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Old 04-25-2003, 04:55 AM   #1
Lechium
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What's wrong with you, people?

Many of you reacted to the lawsuit based on an impulse, rather than cold reason... here's what's really happened.

People pay $50+ to see band perform a show.

Lead singer appears drunk, or high on prescribed drugs, and fails to do a acceptable performance.

People did not get what they paid for, so right things to do would be
a) offer people a refund
B) schedule a show for some time later, and let peopel for ticket for teh faild show in. Yeah they get 2 shows, but one was a failure.


Say you call (and pre-pay) a plumber to fix your drain, and he shows up drunk, fixes your drain only partially (so it's still somewhat clogged) dances around your aprtment, and does other obnoxiosu stuff, and than leaves. What would you do? Let it be? Dont think so.

I dont agree with 2 mil part, but refund is a must. creed did not earn that money, and they should give it back. Simple as that.

Now flame away.
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Old 04-25-2003, 07:26 AM   #2
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Lechium,

They don't care here. It's too rational an explanation. All they care about is the delusion that the band is being persecuted. They are like most other enablers for people who drink to excess. They are in denial. They make excuses. Then they get angry, defensive and shut you out. Welcome to their world. They'll now tell you to go to hell and leave.

<sigh>

I never thought I'd meet MEAN Creed fans. But I did. They are here. In droves.

--*Rob
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Old 04-25-2003, 09:06 AM   #3
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LEECH~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~SHUT~~~~UP!!!!!!!!!!!!!!:rolle yes:
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Old 04-25-2003, 10:20 AM   #4
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Quote: Originally posted by robaustin1701

I never thought I'd meet MEAN Creed fans. &nbsp;But I did. &nbsp;They are here. &nbsp;In droves. &nbsp;

--*Rob
Ok, if we are so mean, go back to the Pit where they are nice over there!! We've heard what a freindly bunch they are.


And Lech, I pay a plumber NOT to entertain me, but to do a service on my pipes. You are comparing apples to oranges. A plumber is in a business to provide a physical service to your house. An entertainer is there to entertain, not fix your roof or unclog your pipes. Big difference. Mark, Brett & Flip played the music and did some singing. No one is doubting that Scott did not live up to everyones expectations of him that night. But a lawsuit is assinine.
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Old 04-25-2003, 11:00 AM   #5
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If you go to the SuperBowl and your team plays horrible....do you get your money back??? NO!!! If you spend a fortune to see your favorite star on Broadway....and you get there only to see the understudy...do you get your money back??? NO!!
Where on the ticket did it give a money back guarentee??
It doesn't. This is just the chance you take. Grow Up People.
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Old 04-25-2003, 11:14 AM   #6
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Naah....I think you had wron njcreedite....I think the fans should heve there money back....I know that it's like you say about Broadway and everything, but it's not right....I think Creed should give the fans the money back....It's a way to show the fans how mush they appreciate there fans....Without us Creed shoulden't be nothing AT ALL....."We love you, like a pigg love korn" --Mark Tremonti to the fans....Come on Creed....Some one have to be the first one! Show the world that you're the most kind band in the whol world....I mean....Creed have A LOT of money....Ain't more than right....
Come on Creed....I know you can do it, come on!
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Old 04-25-2003, 11:23 AM   #7
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Quote: Originally posted by njcreedite
If you go to the SuperBowl and your team plays horrible....do you get your money back??? &nbsp;NO!!! &nbsp;If you spend a fortune to see your favorite star on Broadway....and you get there only to see the understudy...do you get your money back??? NO!!
Where on the ticket did it give a money back guarentee??
It doesn't. &nbsp;This is just the chance you take. &nbsp;Grow Up People.


Uh - actually on broadway - if an understudy is present - you can get a refund or tickets to another peformance instead. That's why they put those notices up before you enter the theater AND in the Playbill if an understudy is being used. They will absolutely do that - because they understand the importance of giving people what they came to see - the star.

Also - I asked my friend who works for a broadway show promoter (who promotes all the broadway road shows) if what happened to Creed happened to a broadway show - where the lead perfomer was drunk and didn't sing and pulled what Scott did - she said they would absolutely refund the money of anyone who wanted the refund, because they realize the weight that the lead performer carries over the other members of the company.

The sports event analogy doesn't hold water. You WANT your team to win - but the enjoyment of the game isn't diminished if they lose.

However, in the case of a concert - if the lead singer - an integral part of the band and the glue that holds all the songs together - doesn't perform even close to what they do on each and every other show on the tour - then yes, I believe they deserve their money back.

<Bangs head against wall some more>

--*Rob
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Old 04-25-2003, 12:35 PM   #8
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yep, but if you bought a ticket to the concert for 50 bucks, you bought the whole package...

so, 2 bands opened the concert for Creed... 50/3= ~16, 67

so, if they didnīt like Creed, they should ask for ~16,67 dollars :P

tha was clever! :P lol!
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Old 04-25-2003, 12:37 PM   #9
Bridge of Clay
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oh, wait... 16,67 / Flip+Mark+Brett+Scott (4) = ~ $ 4.17

thatīs it! they should get back less than 5 dollars!!!

yeah, I rule at Math!!!!!!
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Old 04-25-2003, 12:49 PM   #10
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You tell me that the majority of the people were there to see all 3 bands? Come on. You KNOW they're there to see Creed, and no one else but Creed. Creed as the "main attraction" - playing for an hour and 40 minutes - versus each opening band playing for maybe 30 minutes?

Creed was the reason people were there.

--*Rob
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Old 04-25-2003, 12:55 PM   #11
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Lechium, saying that people reacted to this lawsuit on impulse is ridiculous. Just because you don't agree does not mean their opinions are not valid. Rock stars appearing drunk, high or both has been going on since the music began. Fifteen or 20 years ago, this lawsuit would never even have been contemplated; we live in a far more litigious society now. And according to the complaint, the standard language of *other damages deemed appropriate by the court* also was included in the lawsuit. If these people were simply out to get just their refund, there would be no need for such language. They are out to see what else they can get besides a refund.

Also, drugs and alcohol have been a part of the rock music scene forever. Some fans are just upset because they thought perhaps that Creed were different in that respect. People too often put musicians on a pedestal where they simply don't belong. As Jen said, why hasn't Marilyn Manson or Nine Inch Nails or Aerosmith been sued for similar incidents, or Guns N Roses? Because people expect that of them, but they don't expect it from Creed because of the image the band has tried to maintain. It's almost impossible to be squeaky clean in the rock world. Just the way it is. Creed are being held to this higher standard and it's just not fair. It's unfortunate what happened. I make no excuses or *enable* him in the manner in which others sometimes do with alcoholics or drug abusers. I worship the music, not the musician.

And Rob, the people here are not mean, otherwise, I would never have stayed here. I detect frustration on their part more than anything. If it's so hostile here, then why do you keep coming back?
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Old 04-25-2003, 12:57 PM   #12
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I'm a masochist.

--*Rob
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Old 04-25-2003, 12:58 PM   #13
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:lol: Rob .
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Old 04-25-2003, 01:14 PM   #14
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Quote: Originally posted by robaustin1701
Lechium,

They don't care here. &nbsp;It's too rational an explanation. &nbsp;All they care about is the delusion that the band is being persecuted. &nbsp;They are like most other enablers for people who drink to excess. &nbsp;They are in denial. They make excuses. &nbsp;Then they get angry, defensive and shut you out. &nbsp;Welcome to their world. &nbsp;They'll now tell you to go to hell and leave.

<sigh>

I never thought I'd meet MEAN Creed fans. &nbsp;But I did. &nbsp;They are here. &nbsp;In droves. &nbsp;

--*Rob


Ya know ... this just about does it for me!

How DARE YOU make this statement!? You say you want "rational" debates ... which I (as well as others) tried to give you in another thread ... but if you'll notice, I didn't even bother to respond to you again ... even though you made it your job to continue "quoting" me. I give up on even trying to respond ... because YOU, apparently, are the one who is close-minded. You can't even admit (or perhaps it's because you just don't understand logic beyond your own) that people here ALSO have good, valid points!

You think that just because we don't agree with you, that we are wearing blinders or are "delusional" ... how about just accepting that you are not the almighty God with all the right answers!

"They are like most other enablers for people who drink to excess." ....... What the F are you even babbling about!?!? You're not making any sense!

NO ONE is saying that there is nothing wrong with what happened ... but a lawsuit is STUPID!!!! It can potentially destroy Creed's reputation and it is uncalled for. You're not looking for a good debate ... you're just here to *try to* make everyone here believe your bull$hit! You try to pass yourself off as the only one here with a brain! Well guess what ... YOU'RE NOT! You are just stuck on your beliefs and have no interest in hearing what others have to say. Several people on this board (including myself) have said you've made some valid points ... we just don't agree with the actual lawsuit. But have you even ONCE returned to us with admitting WE'VE made some good points????? NO! Because you are too busy in your "closed mind" to give anyone that satisfaction. All you do is try to say that our points are NOT valid.

I have admitted that Creed ... and/or Scott ... should have made good for what happened ... or better yet ... not let it have happened at all. But it did! It's over! These people with this lawsuit are taking it WAY too far! You can <sigh, sigh, sigh> all you want ... but the fact remains that you're incapable of allowing yourself to give a little and see that WE TOO have valid points!

Do you get it??? Or is this "too rational an explanation" for you?

And Lechium ...
I actually have not had time to post on here a lot lately ... but what happened??? Last I knew, you were kicked off somewhere back at "666" number of posts (what a shock!!).

I am through "debating" with people who have no room in their little minds to see another side! :madder:
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Old 04-25-2003, 01:18 PM   #15
Bridge of Clay
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Quote: Originally posted by robaustin1701
<b>You tell me that the majority of the people were there to see all 3 bands? &nbsp;Come on. You KNOW they're there to see Creed, and no one else but Creed. &nbsp;Creed as the "main attraction" - playing for an hour and 40 minutes - versus each opening band playing for maybe 30 minutes?

Creed was the reason people were there.

--*Rob </b>


yep, they were there to see Creed buy they bought a 3-concerts package. And they saw Creed: Mark was there, Flip was there and Stapp was almost the whole time there...

Now, if they went to the concert to see only stapp, maybe then they are right

hehehehe

You claim yourself to be so smart and canīt notice when someone is just kidding...
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