...quote from Paradise Lost

[Steve]

Lechium, in your example, "hellish" is being used as a verb. In your original question, you are using "heaven" and "hell" as nouns. The definition of "hell" as a noun according to dictionary.com is:

1.

a. often Hell The abode of condemned souls and devils in some religions; the place of eternal punishment for the wicked after death, presided over by Satan.
b. A state of separation from God; exclusion from God's presence.

2.

The abode of the dead, identified with the Hebrew Sheol and the Greek Hades; the underworld.

3.

a. A situation or place of evil, misery, discord, or destruction: “War is hell” (William Tecumseh Sherman).
b. Torment; anguish: went through hell on the job.

4.

a. The powers of darkness and evil.
b. Informal. One that causes trouble, agony, or annoyance: The boss is hell when a job is poorly done.

5.

A sharp scolding: gave the student hell for cheating.


6.
Informal. Excitement, mischievousness, or high spirits: We did it for the sheer hell of it.

7.

a. A tailor's receptacle for discarded material.
b. Printing. A hellbox.


8.

Informal. Used as an intensive: How the hell can I go? You did one hell of a job.


9.

Archaic. A gambling house.

------------------

Unless you are referring to "hell" as a gambling house or a tailor's receptacle for discarded materials in your question, then hell takes the meaning of a place of evil, darkness, dead, etc. This happens to be the similar definition of hell in a religious sense. So when people are answering the question with religious feelings, it is acceptable and understandable.

If you look up the definition of "heaven" on dictionary.com you'll notice the same as I described above, except for the fact that heaven refers to a place of peace, happiness, delight, etc.

Back to the question: I ask you, why would you wish to rule a place of evil when you have the opportunity to live in peace and delight? The question at hand is fairly broad, but with some analyzing and thinking one can narrow down it's meaning. What does "serving" mean in heaven? Does it mean you have to condone physical labor on a constant basis or does it mean you simply have to believe in heaven or a/the God? Obviously, unless constant physical labor is delightful to you, it would contradict the definition of heaven and thus make no sense. You'd have to conclude that "serving" is referring to something that is peaceful or delightful to the individual and thus, why would you not choose heaven?

Personally, I'd go with heaven.

[goddess_bb]

Incrediable Steve...excellent point..

My I believe hell is a place or anyplace with a absence of GOD.. think about it...

(braces for Lech's reply...)

[Lechium]

You people amaze me...
When I said not to use biblical connotation, you're still stickng to it.
Ok here are things spelled out for you.

Would you rather be say a well respected person with social status in a small poor village in Africa, with 50% of peopel dying from AIDS (say a local chieftain or something), or would you be an office worker in a developed country, who drives a nice car and such, and always tries to please his boss for a tiny promotion he craves for.

What woudl you choose?

[StrubesGuitar]

We stick to it because we are what are. I can't be smthg i am not. I will stay my true self no matter what. We would pick the guy w/the car and other stuff. But are u suggesting that the African example would be heaven and the office dude would be hell, assuming that ur saying u reign in that office world, and serve in that African country? Wealth is fleeting and worthless in the long run. Even some of the most wealthy and distinguished people in the world wish they didn't have all their $.

[Steve]

Quote:

Originally posted by Lechium
You people amaze me...
When I said not to use biblical connotation, you're still stickng to it.

You amaze me. Did you read any part of my post?

[Higher_Desire]

It means that it is better to be a ruler over a bunch of people who have done bad and are now being punished, working for you, than to be a servant to a perfect being who never made mistakes. Why rule over good people who do almost no wrong when you can punish and run on power by ruling over sinners?


H-D

[JulieCitySlicker]

Quote:

Originally posted by Lechium
You people amaze me...
When I said not to use biblical connotation, you're still stickng to it.
Ok here are things spelled out for you.

Would you rather be say a well respected  person with social status in a small poor village in Africa, with 50% of peopel dying from AIDS (say a local chieftain or something), or would you be an office worker in a developed country, who drives a nice car and such, and always tries to please his boss for a tiny promotion he craves for.

What woudl you choose?

Well DUH!!! WE use it because it is what we BELIEVE in! Thank you very much

[mel!ssa]

Leech, if you didn't want people to think of hell in the biblical sense, why did you post it in the faith/religion forum? :lol:

[Bridge of Clay]

I´m just watching!

Anyway, let´s think of this:

You rule in Hell: so you rule jealous and envious and evil and ass-kisser people.

You serve in Heaven: a peaceful and delightful place with good and just human beings like you. People are happy and people are helpful.

That stated, let´s assume: On Heaven, you won´t have problems. On hell, it´s more than possible violence exists. So, you´re reigning there, but for how long? You know your servers may be planning an evil conspiratory plot to remove you of your place and "kill" you. Therefore, you´ll live with fear, hiding from people and ordering a "trustful" "friend" (for how long?) as a spokeperson.

I´ll stick with heaven!

[goddess_bb]

LECH---
Faith is not a logical thing..it's just something that you feel...so Doll, quit trying to make it logical it will never work and you will never win an argument here...
We all believe deepy nothing is going to change that...

[Lechium]

Quote:

Originally posted by Steve
<b>Back to the question: I ask you, why would you wish to rule a place of evil when you have the opportunity to live in peace and delight? The question at hand is fairly broad, but with some analyzing and thinking one can narrow down it's meaning. What does "serving" mean in heaven?</b>

"serve" can mean many things, but above all it means that you're not free, you have people above you who tell you what to do, and most importantly you depend on others.

So would you rather depend on others and not be free, but in nice conditions, or would you be in charge and not depend on others, in a shithole?

That's one way to look at this question. This is quote from "Paradise Lost" so dont ask me what exaclty it means lol

2goddes: The spiritual world, the afterlife exist and therefore can be understood and studied. That's why I choose not to have faith in dogma someone else had written.

[Steve]

Quote:

Originally posted by Lechium
2goddes: The spiritual world, the afterlife exist and therefore can be understood and studied. That's why I choose not to have faith in dogma someone else had written.

Saying "spiritual world exists" is an oxymoron and quite false. Spiritual means "Of, relating to, consisting of, or having the nature of spirit; not tangible or material" - so how can something not tangible or material exist in our physical world? The spiritual world and the afterlife is something that you believe in. There is no physical evidence of a spiritual world or the afterlife other than individual accounts of what they experienced - an "out of body" experience. That is hardly physical evidence. (If there is physical evidence, then I stand corrected - but please show me where this is documented)

[mel!ssa]

You didn't answer my question, but anyway...

In answer to your original question, I'd go with heaven. What's so wrong with serving? Since when is being the guy on top the most important thing in the world? Personally i'd rather let someone else be the boss, i haven't got a problem with being told what to do rather than being the one who's telling others what to do... I haven't got an authority problem...

[Lechium]

Quote:

Originally posted by Steve
<b>Saying "spiritual world exists" is an oxymoron and quite false. Spiritual means "Of, relating to, consisting of, or having the nature of spirit; not tangible or material" - so how can something not tangible or material exist in our physical world?</b>

When did I say "in our physical world"? It exists in parallel to our physical world (I think). I never said that it was tangeble.

Quote:

Originally posted by Steve
<b>The spiritual world and the afterlife is something that you believe in. There is no physical evidence of a spiritual world or the afterlife other than individual accounts of what they experienced - an "out of body" experience. That is hardly physical evidence.</b>

OOBE was studied a lot, and still is, so it does sound pretty possible. At least they dont say "gotta have faith" but try to figure out conditions in which OOBE is possible, and such.

Quote:

Originally posted by Steve
(If there is physical evidence, then I stand corrected - but please show me where this is documented)

Well you cant really have physical evidence of nonphysical world, now can you? =)

2mel: you asked me what religion I was, and I answered to my best ability...

[Steve]

Lechium, you asked for a logical look at this topic, so that's what I'm doing...

Quote:

When did I say "in our physical world"?

You implied that when you asked to answer the question logically.

Quote:

Well you cant really have physical evidence of nonphysical world, now can you? =)

Logically, it cannot exist if there is no physical evidence of it existing. I would say it's a matter of faith unless there's documented proof it exists. (and I don't think an individuals account of what they experienced while in a coma is documentable proof).