Longevity

[guitardude1985]

I wonder how long AB will be around? I mean, I'm hearing all this that AB could potentially be droped from wind-up...any confermation on that? Anyway, if they do I wonder what their going to do.

[SecretWeapon]

Finally get huge ? :D

[Unforgiven Fan]

i doubt wind-up will drop alter bridge in the short term, longevity for Alter Bridge is questionable because it depends on wheather their sound strikes a cord in rock music listeners and because they are a band with memebers in there 30's there is a possiblity that wind-up will do even less market for them unless they have a huge hit because these types of bands usally drop of the radar.

[The Lithium]

I think AB would drop WU before WU dropped AB...


ABB.net: What can Alter Bridge fans expect for the future?

Michael Tremonti: You can expect Alter Bridge to go out there and kick your ass every single night. They keep getting better and better, their shows are becoming more involved. There will be many more CD’s, concerts, live performances in the future. These guys are in it for the long haul! It’s going to be a great, great future!

[Creed7352]

where have you been hearing that WU is going to drop them?

[titan9]

I really doubt that WU would drop them. If anyone drops anyone, it's gonna be AB dropping WU. WU sucks at promotion, unless it is for a well known band/artist.

All the members of AB, as far as I can tell, are very happy to be in the band. I honestly see it sticking around for as long as the members feel like making music. Hopefully that is a long time.

[evyllsummer]

it's going to be difficult for ANY band to get really huge right now...I think that the best case scenario for AB is to get maybe Audioslave or even Incubus big...neither Stapp nor AB could achieve Creed big in today's market...even Creed would have a difficult time...

[jammy123]

even Creed would have a difficult time...
i wudnt agree to that but goin thr is COMPLETELY pointless

[RoffeDH]

IF, and I mean IF, WU dropps AB I think that AB will start their own lable seeing they have the money to promot themselfs now and stuff... Plus I think that they would get some bands to come join them... Atleast Submeresed would, if they could that is. But don't think that WU will...

If I recall this right, didn't Mark say he didn't want the band to get to promoted? That he wanted to start from the bottom and work his way up, playing at small venues? So I'm not shure that it's WUs foult!

[bobben]

I thnik that the reason why these rumours are out is that it seems like Tremonti doesn't want big advertising and high promotion...and that's something that no recordlabel want to hear from a band! It's all about the money for them (WU).

[evyllsummer]

IF, and I mean IF, WU dropps AB I think that AB will start their own lable seeing they have the money to promot themselfs now and stuff... Plus I think that they would get some bands to come join them... Atleast Submeresed would, if they could that is. But don't think that WU will...

If I recall this right, didn't Mark say he didn't want the band to get to promoted? That he wanted to start from the bottom and work his way up, playing at small venues? So I'm not shure that it's WUs foult!

no, he wanted the band promoted, he just didn't want to have the promotion involving capitalizing on how they were formerly Creed, and Windup didn't like that at all, so Windup pretty much stopped all the promotion altogether after OYE...

[RoffeDH]

Hmmm... Might be evyllsummer, but that's not how I recall it... Might as well ask them...

[evyllsummer]

Well, why would they NOT want promoted? I would LOVE to see the interview where Mark said that he DIDN'T want promoted...as for starting out with smaller venues, they had NO CHOICE...and, as for Mark's opinion of Windup's lack of participation, he made his feelings pretty clear in his last interview...I'll find it...

[evyllsummer]

Alter Bridge sets foot on Dutch soil for the fourth time. Today as part of a eight-gig Brittish tour, with one sidetrack to Europe's mainland. The concert in the Amsterdam concertchurch Paradiso is already sold out for over two months. I can be very clear about the performance: astounding, with all four bandmembers in topshape. Their entire debutalbum passes the set except for
"Shed My Skin", and theyve added coversongs "Whole Lotta Rosie" (AC/DC) and "Rock and Roll" (Led Zeppelin). The crowd sings along to the lyrics of almost every song. Singer Myles Kennedy uses his guitar more often than at the earlier gigs (he even was allowed to do a solo). Also the openingband, Logan from Glasgow - call them a mix between Creed and Alter Bridge - manages to win over many hearts in the crowd and will eventually sell over 100 copies of their demo-album. Short before the concert i spoke to Marc Tremonti.

'All That Remains' is released almost one and a half years ago, and during the soundcheck i heard several news songs. Why wont they play them during the gig? Cuz with only one album under their belt and refusing to play old material of Creed or The Mayfield Four, new songs could prolongue the concert past the one hour limit. Tremonti was obviously taken by surprise by this question.

"We dont have new songs yet."

He replied without hesitation, so i will try to get an answer out of him in a different way. I read in Billboard magazine a large article about your recordlabel Wind-up. In their success-story Alan and Diana Meltzer, the most important people of the label, paised Evanescence, Creed and almost every other band in their label. Except for Alter Bridge, who by now have reach Gold in sales, they werent mentioned at all. For me a sign the label doesnt think Alter Bridge are important.

"You put it in a friendly way. Nothing bad can be said about Sony/BMG, they do the right thing in Europe, but i cannot even be close to positive about Wind-Up"

It looks like the label is focussing mainly on Scott Stapp and his solo-album "The Great Devide". When you visit Wind-Ups website it's Stapp this and Stapp that. Even the Creed-site doesnt mention Alter Bridge at all, while Stapps new record is allover the place.

"So you noticed that too! Since his solo-album was released ive been getting a lot of fanmail in which diehard creedfans express their feelings saying his album was dissapointing. It apparently is way too sweet/soft for them."

Do you think Scott Stapp is trying to make you look bad towards Wind-Up?

"Scott shares the bed with the Meltzerfamily, thats very obvious by now."

Can you guys talk with the label about their position towards you guys?

"We've been doing that for over a year now, but they end all the conversations with a 'fuck you' every time."

Is that one of the reasons you're still not in the studios recording a second album?

"Let me put it this way, we will be in the studio by summer 2006, whatever will happen."

So the troubles with Wind-Up are the reason you're not playing new songs live?

"We don't have any new songs."

The guitarist replied this time with a little smile on his face. Alright, in a different approach: if you play a new song during the time youre under contract with a label, would that new song be property by that label? Marc can hardly avoid the answer to this question.

"That could be possible."

I've heard you guys wanted to release a live DVD to show some signs of life.

"How did you find that out? Indeed, we wanted to tape a concert, but our recordlabel didnt want to spend money on it. Then we offered them to pay for it ourselves - afterall there are a few milionaires in this band - and they still did not want to release it."

That of course is difficult to understand. What caught my attention aswell is that this gig was sold out for well over two months.

"The reason for that is without a doubt our performance at the Fields of Rock festival. Ever since we took the stage over there we noticed our popularity in The Netherlands increased rapidly. We would love to thank you all for that."

[Soundslave]

I was just going to go looking for that at article when I started to read the thread.

I really hope:


The guitarist replied this time with a little smile on his face. Alright, in a different approach: if you play a new song during the time youre under contract with a label, would that new song be property by that label? Marc can hardly avoid the answer to this question.

"That could be possible."

means that they aren't playing any new songs truely because the next album will be under a different label.

[Soundslave]

ooops double post

[evyllsummer]

I was just going to go looking for that at article when I started to read the thread.

I really hope:



means that they aren't playing any new songs truely because the next album will be under a different label.

one can only hope...

[GregS]

AB will stick with Windup for the 2nd album for sure. For the rest of their bandlife.. who knows ?

[SecretWeapon]

Gosh , but i hope that they do switch , AB and WU is really seeming to be a miserable co-exsisance . And btw , how do i know that's a real interview?
Don't articles like that usually have proper spelling/grammer ? That one was loaded with errors and typos ...

[RMadd]

ay, i really wish AB would kick WU to the curb as well. i understand Roadrunner Records tends to sign metal bands; seems like they would be a perfect fit (i'm not saying i've heard anything, i'm just putting forth some useless speculation/wishing)

[Creed7352]

Gosh , but i hope that they do switch , AB and WU is really seeming to be a miserable co-exsisance . And btw , how do i know that's a real interview?
Don't articles like that usually have proper spelling/grammer ? That one was loaded with errors and typos ...

because it came from a dutch magazine and that is translated literally into english...translations don't always come out the way they should properly be written.

axlar typed it up and has scans if you don't believe me. i don't think he's a member here though, so you might look elsewhere to hunt him down.

[titan9]

Given what Mark said in that interview, I kinda doubt WU will want to keep AB around for another album. I can't imagine a label being happy with a member of one of their signed bands bashing them like that. I know I'd be pissed if I were WU's president and heard that coming from Mark's mouth, even if it is the honest to God truth(and I don't doubt it at this point). It's true, WU has given an awful lot of promotion to Stapp.....but who honestly did not expect that? He WAS the frontman for the biggest rock band(outside of U2) in the past 6-8 years. It's been said thousands of times that lead singers are always the most known members in a band. Why wouldn't WU want to capitalize on that fact? They'd be stupid not to. Regardless, they haven't given AB the promotion they deserved. But the same exact thing can be said for Big Dismal, 12 Stones, Submersed, Seven Wiser etc. AB isn't the only band being screwed.

[RoffeDH]

Well, why would they NOT want promoted? I would LOVE to see the interview where Mark said that he DIDN'T want promoted...as for starting out with smaller venues, they had NO CHOICE...and, as for Mark's opinion of Windup's lack of participation, he made his feelings pretty clear in his last interview...I'll find it...

Look evyllsummer! I said I was probobly wrong! But that I remembered it that way! Don't have to have hard feelings man ;)

I am truly and utterly squashed by that article about them not wanting too much promotion!

But can't AB just releas it themselfs? Or would that be a hole lot of truble for them, I don't know any thing about music law... So... :P But that means that they were filming for a DVD in London this last time! I new it! Hope WU will change their minds about letting AB realse it! (Seeing as their paying it themselfs and all! Idiots!)

And, I must say I realy liked the Stapp Bashing... I know I know many of you will be mad at me but I thought that the bashing was realy... Good :P

I'll burn in hell for this one! :mad1:

[Ana4Stapp]

I'll burn in hell for this one! :mad1:

Lol! NO you wont, Roffe! ;) lol

[GregS]

ay, i really wish AB would kick WU to the curb as well. i understand Roadrunner Records tends to sign metal bands; seems like they would be a perfect fit (i'm not saying i've heard anything, i'm just putting forth some useless speculation/wishing)

Ye , true RR usually only sign Metal bands but i wouldnt exactly call AB metal. I mean what heavy songs have they got.. Metalingus , Watch your words & One Day Remains i suppose. Thats about it. But if what Mark says is true , the next album being really heavy then its a possibilty for the future.

[Ana4Stapp]

ay, i really wish AB would kick WU to the curb as well. i understand Roadrunner Records tends to sign metal bands; seems like they would be a perfect fit (i'm not saying i've heard anything, i'm just putting forth some useless speculation/wishing)


So technically are you saying that AB needs to choose another label because WU already choosed Stapp? :rolleyes:

[evyllsummer]

Look evyllsummer! I said I was probobly wrong! But that I remembered it that way! Don't have to have hard feelings man ;)

LOL...relax, man, I'm not mad at all, and I certainly don't want to seem that way, I just wanted to clarify what I believe Mark's intentions were. When they were faced with the possibility of either opening for a bigger band and bigger venues or headlining smaller venues, Mark chose to focus on the smaller venues so that he and the rest of AB could be closer to their fans, hang out with them, and so forth. Other than wanting to avoid the Creed connection as much as possible (despite having to deal with the questions all the time), the focus on smaller venues is how Mark wanted to begin. If they had chosen to focus on being an opening act, it may have been more successful in the short term, but I think that Mark was looking at the long term, and wanted to have a strong fan base.

But can't AB just releas it themselfs? Or would that be a hole lot of truble for them, I don't know any thing about music law... So... :P But that means that they were filming for a DVD in London this last time! I new it! Hope WU will change their minds about letting AB realse it! (Seeing as their paying it themselfs and all! Idiots!)

No, they can't release it themselves apparently...I would imagine that it has something to do with their contract, as Mark clearly stated in that interview that the band would have even funded it themselves. This illustrates just how much WU DOESN'T want to promote AB...when the band offers to pay for the whole thing, and the label STILL won't release it, it would seem that the label has NO intention of helping AB AT ALL, and, in this case, it also seems as if they will even HINDER AB at expense to themselves when at all possible...because, in this case, if the band paid for everything else, and WU were only paying for distribution, WU is the ONLY one in that scenario that is almost GUARANTEED a profit of SOME sort...instead, they would rather see AB fail than to even make ANY money helping them at ALL...

And this is the most infuriating thing about it all...Windup are really more vindictive than they are stupid. They seem to be angry at AB because AB refused Windup's suggestions to take steps to capitalize off of Creed's former success (like they are doing with Stapp currently), so, instead of coming up with another strategy for AB, they seem to be putting a stop to the AB promotion altogether. Then, they got to put their strategy into motion with Stapp, who clearly didn't have a problem with using Creed in his promotion, and Windup is seeing right now that the strategy they had for AB CLEARLY isn't working very well for Stapp, which would prove them WRONG, but, instead of admitting the mistake (and this is where their stupidity IS coming into play), they are going to run themselves into the ground to make Stapp a success at ALL COSTS...hopefully, Windup will ride that strategy out until they're bankrupt...

[The Lithium]

Ye , true RR usually only sign Metal bands but i wouldnt exactly call AB metal. I mean what heavy songs have they got.. Metalingus , Watch your words & One Day Remains i suppose. Thats about it. But if what Mark says is true , the next album being really heavy then its a possibilty for the future.
RR has bands like Theory Of A Deadman! They're not metal! AB are heavier than those guys are

And I really do hope AB leaves Screw-Up, 'cause they're just... AARRGH, Screw-Up are really missing a chance! I mean, WHY wouldn't they want to release a DVD if the band members payed it? Maybe they should join Sony/BMG in the states as well. Or create their own label, and give themselves ALL the promotion they want! :D AB would've been huge by now if WU would have promoted them. But I guess Screw-Up doesn't want to spend time or money for the band and for the people who made them, and made them big! (And rich)...

[titan9]

RR has bands like Theory Of A Deadman!

Don't forget Nickelcrap.....

[RoffeDH]

Thanks Ana! Means alot... :P

Screw screw-up!

[SecretWeapon]

But I guess Screw-Up doesn't want to spend time or money to the band and the people who made them, and made them big! (And rich)...

well , if theyre that stupid , maybe theyll let AB go . Or not ...
(wow , 2 whole pages and still on topic , im not used to that. lol)

[GregS]

RR has bands like Theory Of A Deadman! They're not metal! AB are heavier than those guys are

And I really do hope AB leaves Screw-Up, 'cause they're just... AARRGH, Screw-Up are really missing a chance! I mean, WHY wouldn't they want to release a DVD if the band members payed it? Maybe they should join Sony/BMG in the states as well. Or create their own label, and give themselves ALL the promotion they want! :D AB would've been huge by now if WU would have promoted them. But I guess Screw-Up doesn't want to spend time or money to the band and the people who made them, and made them big! (And rich)...

Totally forgot about them lol and ye Nickleback too.. oh and nightwish.. Ah well i was mistaken , maybe Ab can fit in there then ;)

[RoffeDH]

OT: Nightwish just kicked their singer....

AB would fit better then them! BUT! I do hope they'll start their own record lable... That would be the best thing to do, they would be able to do what ever they wanted then!

[Ana4Stapp]

Thanks Ana! Means alot... :P




;)

[The Lithium]

Don't forget Nickelcrap.....
Hey, I actually like those guys! :D

But yeah, I thought of them too. I think AB would be fine on Roadrunner Records.

But how about Epic/Sony Music? They seem like an alright label... But I do like the idea of the guys starting their own label. There's it no way they're gonna get screwed over if they do that. (Unless they feel like screwing themselves over, but why...?)

[GregS]

OT: Nightwish just kicked their singer....

AB would fit better then them! BUT! I do hope they'll start their own record lable... That would be the best thing to do, they would be able to do what ever they wanted then!

Ye , Nightwish gonna be even worse than they were now that their popular lead singer has gone..

[guitardude1985]

well , if theyre that stupid , maybe theyll let AB go . Or not ...
(wow , 2 whole pages and still on topic , im not used to that. lol)

I tell you what, I start some thought provoking posts huh?

Anyway it's still a little unlclear for what I have read wether AB will or will not be dropped from wind-up. I have posted my thoughts and I will say again that it's totally fucked up that WU is screwing 3/4ths of the band that got them on the map. I know it's entirely true that in most cases of bands getting to be of commercial jugernaut status like creed, the singer is always the one who will be most recognized. And to alot of less techical and musicianal aspect the rest kinda gets way less recognozed (Except zeppelin, where page a plant were THEE rock team).

If wind-up does drop AB, then sure...why not go to sony or road runner. However, I'm not so sure they won't be doing the same thing wind-up is doing.

[guitardude1985]

Oh and one last observation, if you count stapps total sales now and AB's sales you get roughly around 180,000 (and if I'm doing these wrong based on what I have read from reports on VH1 or other notable music sources, don't shit on me to bad, and I'll just say MY bad) which is not even half of what weathered was selling four years ago...so....I guess both stapp and AB could be doing better but...yea...later.

[Creed7352]

um yeah you're wrong with that number...unless maybe you meant 1,800,000...that could be closer to correct, cause ab's are over 700,000 to my knowledge.

[RoffeDH]

Yeah... 700.000 is what I counted, and Stapp's sold roughly the same...

Then you can take the marketing in tot he calculation, how much have AB had and how much have Stapp had? AB= second to none and Stapp = alot!

OT: The ex-singer in Nightwish wasn't that popular since she was a diva, she never talked to fans and so... My friend knows the guitarrist (think it's him) in nightwish and he's said the band been wanting to kick her for a long time! Don't know what will happen to them now though

[titan9]

Hey, I actually like those guys! :D

Lol, they wore out their welcome when "Someday" got played for the 1,000 time on the radio. Now I can't stand that band. :laugh:


But yeah, I thought of them too. I think AB would be fine on Roadrunner Records.

But how about Epic/Sony Music? They seem like an alright label... But I do like the idea of the guys starting their own label. There's it no way they're gonna get screwed over if they do that. (Unless they feel like screwing themselves over, but why...?)

I don't know about RR. Didn't they have a poll a month or two ago essentially bashing Creed/AB/Stapp? I can't remember what it said exactly, but I do know that it trashed them. And I don't know how well RR promotes their artists. I mean, I guess they must be doing a good job with Nickelback, seeing as how they're all over the place. Theory of A Deadman is doing pretty well, too. But I'm not sure RR would be a good fit for AB.

Sony seems to do a good job with promoting as well. But they're more mainstream than WU and RR, and perhaps they'd try to force AB into going more commercial with their music? We'll just have to see what happens, I guess.

[titan9]

Yeah... 700.000 is what I counted, and Stapp's sold roughly the same...

Then you can take the marketing in tot he calculation, how much have AB had and how much have Stapp had? AB= second to none and Stapp = alot!

Just to be fair, AB did get good promotion leading up to the release of ODR. Maybe not as good as Stapp's promotion for his solo album, but they still got a fair bit. And I still say that releasing ODR just a mere two months after the break-up was announced helped ODR's record sales some. Creed was still fresh in the minds of potential buyers in August of 2004. A year later, I'd venture to say that a lot of people forgot about Creed, outside of the real fans. So I think that has something to do with Stapp and AB's sales being roughly the same(in terms of week by week sales). Just speculation on my part, though.

And ODR has sold 700,000? That's awesome. Hopefully it eventually goes platinum.

[GregS]

Lol, they wore out their welcome when "Someday" got played for the 1,000 time on the radio. Now I can't stand that band. :laugh:



I don't know about RR. Didn't they have a poll a month or two ago essentially bashing Creed/AB/Stapp? I can't remember what it said exactly, but I do know that it trashed them. And I don't know how well RR promotes their artists. I mean, I guess they must be doing a good job with Nickelback, seeing as how they're all over the place. Theory of A Deadman is doing pretty well, too. But I'm not sure RR would be a good fit for AB.

Sony seems to do a good job with promoting as well. But they're more mainstream than WU and RR, and perhaps they'd try to force AB into going more commercial with their music? We'll just have to see what happens, I guess.

They were just bashing Stapp really. No mention of Ab

[titan9]

You're right. I just did a search and found that thread from a couple of months ago and I guess they did only mention Stapp.

[guitardude1985]

um yeah you're wrong with that number...unless maybe you meant 1,800,000...that could be closer to correct, cause ab's are over 700,000 to my knowledge.

Oh, ok..I needed that figure. Still, because creed split so did the fan base and so did the sales. What I mean, is the way I see it at least is that 50% will buy stapp and 50% have already bought AB's album.

[Creed7352]

actually, it's probably less than that because stapp was only at around like 300,000 sold according to sound scan.

[guitardude1985]

actually, it's probably less than that because stapp was only at around like 300,000 sold according to sound scan.

Hmm...so more of a 60%-40% kinda situation.

[Creed7352]

yeah, if not 70-30

[RoffeDH]

Yeah... 70/30 sounds like a good thing...
I don't think that creeds split helped that much since the only once who new about AB beeing 3/4 of original Creed was the diehard fans... Atleast that's how I've understud this whole situation

[guitardude1985]

Yeah... 70/30 sounds like a good thing...
I don't think that creeds split helped that much since the only once who new about AB beeing 3/4 of original Creed was the diehard fans... Atleast that's how I've understud this whole situation

And also add on the tremonti fans...like me.:D

[Rawker]

I'm hearing all this that AB could potentially be droped from wind-up...any confermation on that?
From what iv been told from a contact of Ab is that they are not getting droped by wind up, they are trying to get out of the wind up deal since they dont like the record company since all WU want is for creed to reform

[guitardude1985]

Oh...well....thats not going to happen any time soon. You know, it's kinda like van halen and it gets me thinking. Why could alter bridge just be creed and with a new singer...like the roth/hagar situation? or.......

[Rawker]

Coz creed, Mark never soloed. and they wouldnt have their new fan base. I am very greatful they started from nothing again and have got to where they are. I hate creed, I hate stapps voice, no solos. Mark was creed anyway. he wrote nearly everything.

[nagpo]

Coz creed, Mark never soloed. and they wouldnt have their new fan base. I am very greatful they started from nothing again and have got to where they are. I hate creed, I hate stapps voice, no solos. Mark was creed anyway. he wrote nearly everything.
wrong, stapp was creed. he wrote most of the stuff.

[nagpo]

i think that if their next album is not better than their first they should be dropped. because if they cant top their first album they probalbly dont have much talent.

[Rawker]

bollocks mate! only thing that made stapp creed is his religious stuff

[nagpo]

bollocks mate! only thing that made stapp creed is his religious stuff
his lyrics? first off they are not religous and with out his lyrics it just wouldent be creed.
EDIT: stapp wrote lyrics and mark wrote music. thats how it was most of the time. stapps lyrics made creed. the music helped but stapp could have made his own music.

[SecretWeapon]

Well , what I think it is , is that Stapp is responsible for alot
of the softer , more beautiful-music part of Creed.(Not that Tremonti
can't write beautiful songs , he wrote In Loving Memory , and the
music to One Last Breath , and very many others. But I think the reason
he wrote so much softer ,pop radio-friendly music was because that's
what Stapp wanted.) And that Mark was responsible for more of the
heavier , harder music , (ie Torn , Bullets) and that's why we have so
many people saying that Stapp's debut sounded "just like Creed" , and
also, we have just as many people saying the exact same thing about
Alter Bridge's debut, but pretty much everybody agrees that Stapp's
debut is vastly different from One Day Remains. Well ,Stapp has proved
that he can write harder songs , like Reach Out , Justify ,and Hardway.
And Mark has proven that he can write prettier songs like In Loving Memory, Broken Wings , and Shed My Skin. But Stapp's TGD is definetly softer
and AB's ODR is definetly harder , so that's my theory. With Mark , Brian,
and Flip , and Stapp all consantly contradicting each others' stories ,
and so many lies and half-truths floating around , it's very hard to
determine fact from fiction...

[Rawker]

thanks secret that makes alot of sense. nagpo yeh stapp wrote lyrics, but the lyrics were shit(in my opinion). Without the music there is nothing for the lyrics.

[Creed7352]

the music helped but stapp could have made his own music.

he did...it's called the great divide...we're seeing just how well that's fairing aren't we?

and on the flipside to that...tremonti could've written his own lyrics...he did (most of anyway, aside from like 3 songs) and it's called one day remains...it's doing better than the great divide.

the second album will be better than the first for odr because it'll be more of a collaboration. the mayfield four albums are great...i can't wait to hear the collaborations of myles and mark.

[nagpo]

thanks secret that makes alot of sense. nagpo yeh stapp wrote lyrics, but the lyrics were shit(in my opinion). Without the music there is nothing for the lyrics.
yeah i get that, but then again stapp could've written all the music if he wanted.

[nagpo]

he did...it's called the great divide...we're seeing just how well that's fairing aren't we?

and on the flipside to that...tremonti could've written his own lyrics...he did (most of anyway, aside from like 3 songs) and it's called one day remains...it's doing better than the great divide.

the second album will be better than the first for odr because it'll be more of a collaboration. the mayfield four albums are great...i can't wait to hear the collaborations of myles and mark.
well hold on there, the great divide hasent been out as long as one day remains.
he wrote most on one day remains...not creed. im talkin creed

[Rawker]

HE wrote most of creeds songs mate, Stapp couldnt right mary had a little lamb, the great divide sucks. Just face it, Stapp is nothing without the rest of them, Tremonti Flip and Marshal were smart to get out and do something better.

[nagpo]

HE wrote most of creeds songs mate, Stapp couldnt right mary had a little lamb, the great divide sucks. Just face it, Stapp is nothing without the rest of them, Tremonti Flip and Marshal were smart to get out and do something better.
post of the year^. you wouldent know good music if it kicked you in the ass. TGD is good (and imo better than one day remaines). listen stapp wrote lyrics and mark wrote the music. im just trying to say if stapp wanted to he could have written the music to and still sell some records.

[Unforgiven Fan]

stapp may have written most lyrics for creed but if you compare tgd's lyrics with mop, hc, or even weathered, in my opinon they do fall short. Stapp had the skills but it is hard to tell if he still has it when writting. Mark was the primary music guy of Creed and frankly ODR lyrics by mark are somewhat better than those found on the TGD, not saying that mark is the better lyrisist but he just did it better on this record and it should get better for the second record because this is going to a mark/myles combo (wishing that flip and brian as some input on the next record to) which might lead to a better longevity and career.

[Creed7352]

my post was lost on you nagpo...

[guitardude1985]

stapp may have written most lyrics for creed but if you compare tgd's lyrics with mop, hc, or even weathered, in my opinon they do fall short. Stapp had the skills but it is hard to tell if he still has it when writting. Mark was the primary music guy of Creed and frankly ODR lyrics by mark are somewhat better than those found on the TGD, not saying that mark is the better lyrisist but he just did it better on this record and it should get better for the second record because this is going to a mark/myles combo (wishing that flip and brian as some input on the next record to) which might lead to a better longevity and career.

I second that completely. However, in ODR flips drumming is very well improved and only furthers me from really viewing him as a average drummer where in metalligus he showed some pretty good skill. However, on alter bridge's next outing I hope to hear more of brian's bass lines. With creed he fit in real nice with those groovy bass lines. In ODR he was pushed so far to the back. You could hear him, but if you knew what to listen for.

[nagpo]

my post was lost on you nagpo...
i dont see how

[Creed7352]

i dont see how

exactly...like i said, lost...

[Rawker]

i wouldnt know good music if it kicked me in the ass?? well why am i on the ab section of this forum u tit. Just face it Stapp is nothing without brian, flip and mark. But Brian, flip and mark are EVERYTHING without stapp. they dont need to hold back any of their potential. Marks Solos are creativly put into the songs and blend in perfectly now he has a lead singer who can also play guitar.
Just face it, im right. TGD has not sold asmay albums as ODR did in the same timestrech.

[The Lithium]

yeah i get that, but then again stapp could've written all the music if he wanted.
See, that's where you're wrong! Just read/watch/listen to Creed's early interviews or Behind The Music. Stapp didn't know anything about music or rock before he met Mark. The only thing he could do was to sing and write lyrics. Mark tried to teach him guitar, but he was pretty hopeless. He just didn't learn.

stapp may have written most lyrics for creed but if you compare tgd's lyrics with mop, hc, or even weathered, in my opinon they do fall short. Stapp had the skills but it is hard to tell if he still has it when writting. Mark was the primary music guy of Creed and frankly ODR lyrics by mark are somewhat better than those found on the TGD, not saying that mark is the better lyrisist but he just did it better on this record and it should get better for the second record because this is going to a mark/myles combo (wishing that flip and brian as some input on the next record to) which might lead to a better longevity and career.
Yeah, that's true! And with both Mark and Myles writing all the lyrics, man... They have written some of the best lyrics I have read in my life! Imagine a whole record for of Mark and Myles-combo! Kick ass! (And yes, TGD lyrics are pretty poor...)

TGD has not sold asmay albums as ODR did in the same timestrech.
Now that's true! Real fact!

[RoffeDH]

I recall that Mark and the guys have said that on some lyrics Stapp changed it without the otherguys wanting it and making in a poorer song. I belive that Mark wrote most lyrics and Stapp changed it, that's how I have interpertated all of it. If you compare the lyrics of Creed with TGD you wont find a singel simmilarity, but if you compare creed and ODR lyrics you'll find some simmilarity like "crown of thorns" (Wash Away Those Years and Find The Real)... This could just mean that Mark "stole" that from the Creed days with Stapp but I higly doubt that!

[nagpo]

i wouldnt know good music if it kicked me in the ass?? well why am i on the ab section of this forum u tit. Just face it Stapp is nothing without brian, flip and mark. But Brian, flip and mark are EVERYTHING without stapp. they dont need to hold back any of their potential. Marks Solos are creativly put into the songs and blend in perfectly now he has a lead singer who can also play guitar.
Just face it, im right. TGD has not sold asmay albums as ODR did in the same timestrech.
your on the ab secton because you like bad music. ab isint very good. in sales yeah, but when it comes to what music is better stapp beats them. they probalby would be everything if their music was any good.

[nagpo]

See, that's where you're wrong! Just read/watch/listen to Creed's early interviews or Behind The Music. Stapp didn't know anything about music or rock before he met Mark. The only thing he could do was to sing and write lyrics. Mark tried to teach him guitar, but he was pretty hopeless. He just didn't learn.


Yeah, that's true! And with both Mark and Myles writing all the lyrics, man... They have written some of the best lyrics I have read in my life! Imagine a whole record for of Mark and Myles-combo! Kick ass! (And yes, TGD lyrics are pretty poor...)


Now that's true! Real fact!
i admit defeat. but i dont see why he would need to play the guitar. well, not ppor just weaker than creed. i dont like ab's lyrics i cant understand myles(its his voice or somthing) and musically i think ab sux hard.

[Anna1011]

your on the ab secton because you like bad music. ab isint very good. in sales yeah, but when it comes to what music is better stapp beats them. they probalby would be everything if their music was any good.
this is why i shouldnt read threads like this cause i get extremly pissed off at comments like that :mad1:

[The Lithium]

I recall that Mark and the guys have said that on some lyrics Stapp changed it without the otherguys wanting it and making in a poorer song. I belive that Mark wrote most lyrics and Stapp changed it, that's how I have interpertated all of it. If you compare the lyrics of Creed with TGD you wont find a singel simmilarity, but if you compare creed and ODR lyrics you'll find some simmilarity like "crown of thorns" (Wash Away Those Years and Find The Real)... This could just mean that Mark "stole" that from the Creed days with Stapp but I higly doubt that!
Well, I think that was mostly for the music, as I remember it, but it makes sence that he did it with the lyrics too.

your on the ab secton because you like bad music. ab isint very good. in sales yeah, but when it comes to what music is better stapp beats them. they probalby would be everything if their music was any good.
Well, here's where you're wrong again. AB is very good, but not in sales. But that's just my opinion.

i admit defeat. but i dont see why he would need to play the guitar. well, not ppor just weaker than creed. i dont like ab's lyrics i cant understand myles(its his voice or somthing) and musically i think ab sux hard.
Yeah well, I'm not gonna get into a "Stapp/AB-sucks" fight, 'cause that ain't discussion, that's opinion meaningless to share in that kind of way. But I respect your opinion, although mine is the exact opposite.

[RoffeDH]

your on the ab secton because you like bad music. ab isint very good. in sales yeah, but when it comes to what music is better stapp beats them. they probalby would be everything if their music was any good.

COME ON!!! Please! Don't you know that opinions are opinions and not fact!!! I can't recall ever hearing the words "Opinions are facts", ever! Not even if you wished that were troue would you say that... Now, IF we look to facts AB rules, AB are ten times better then Stapp. You can't oppose that! Myles is such a better singer, if we just look to the singers since Stapp can't play guitar... Oh! I remember, Myles can! He can even solo on it! Do you need more facts?

And lyrically, Myels is better since Stapps songs are REALY lacking at this point, now he's lacking on all points, but this is probobly THE biggest one! This is also opinions but come on! He's not that good, but if you really are a blind fan, as I was with Creed, and probobly are with AB you'd think they rock! Even if he keeps repeating himself... ALOT!

And please, don't turn this in to a "stapp/AB rules" thread like so many others are!!! But we have to respond on these accusation!

[HuMaN~ClAy]

COME ON!!! Please! Don't you know that opinions are opinions and not fact!!! I can't recall ever hearing the words "Opinions are facts", ever! Not even if you wished that were troue would you say that... Now, IF we look to facts AB rules, AB are ten times better then Stapp. You can't oppose that! Myles is such a better singer, if we just look to the singers since Stapp can't play guitar... Oh! I remember, Myles can! He can even solo on it! Do you need more facts?

And lyrically, Myels is better since Stapps songs are REALY lacking at this point, now he's lacking on all points, but this is probobly THE biggest one! This is also opinions but come on! He's not that good, but if you really are a blind fan, as I was with Creed, and probobly are with AB you'd think they rock! Even if he keeps repeating himself... ALOT!

And please, don't turn this in to a "stapp/AB rules" thread like so many others are!!! But we have to respond on these accusation!


just thought i'd say the only fact in all of that is that stapp doesn't play the guitar... you're calling your opinions, like AB is 10 times better than stapp, facts which they aren't...

and just because myles is technically a better singer doesn't mean we have to like his voice... if it did we would all be listening to Celine Dion... what a terrible world that would be...

but that's all i wanted to say, and that as for your opinions i agree with them 100%... even that myles is a better singer... but that doesn't make them facts...

[nagpo]

1.COME ON!!! Please! Don't you know that opinions are opinions and not fact!!! I can't recall ever hearing the words "Opinions are facts", ever! Not even if you wished that were troue would you say that... 2.Now, IF we look to facts AB rules, AB are ten times better then Stapp. You can't oppose that! 3.Myles is such a better singer, if we just look to the singers since 4.Stapp can't play guitar... Oh! I remember, Myles can! He can even solo on it! Do you need more facts?

5.And lyrically, Myels is better since Stapps songs are REALY lacking at this point, now he's lacking on all points, but this is probobly THE biggest one! This is also opinions but come on! He's not that good, but if you really are a blind fan, as I was with Creed, and probobly are with AB you'd think they rock! Even if he keeps repeating himself... ALOT!

And please, don't turn this in to a "stapp/AB rules" thread like so many others are!!! But we have to respond on these accusation!
1.i know, i think that ab sux so i think you have a bad taste in music cause u like them.
2. thats your openion.
3.maybe...but that doesent mean i have to like, which i dont. i think his voice is sometime annoying and at times i cant understand what he is saying.
4. what does that have to do with any thing? he doesent need to play the guitar.
5. i agree that stapps lyrics are not very strong in some songs but imo they work well with the music.

[guitardude1985]

1.i know, i think that ab sux so i think you have a bad taste in music cause u like them.
2. thats your openion.
3.maybe...but that doesent mean i have to like, which i dont. i think his voice is sometime annoying and at times i cant understand what he is saying.
4. what does that have to do with any thing? he doesent need to play the guitar.
5. i agree that stapps lyrics are not very strong in some songs but imo they work well with the music.

Hey nagpo, a little peice of advice. First your going to get extremely flammed if you keep this shit disturbing up. Secondly, if you dislike AB so much then simply go to the stapp/creed board. Thank you and goodnight.

[RoffeDH]

1.i know, i think that ab sux so i think you have a bad taste in music cause u like them.
2. thats your openion.
3.maybe...but that doesent mean i have to like, which i dont. i think his voice is sometime annoying and at times i cant understand what he is saying.
4. what does that have to do with any thing? he doesent need to play the guitar.
5. i agree that stapps lyrics are not very strong in some songs but imo they work well with the music.

1. You are allowed to have thet opinion, even if I don't agree
2. NOOOO!!! That's not my opinion, since AB are TECHNICALY better they rule if you look to the facts! So no, it's not an opinion even if I agree.
3. I didn't say you'd have to like him! I just said that IF YOU LOOK TO FACTS, witch is the only way too argue, NOT opinions! I had a hard time understanding what Scott sang in the beginning, but once I got used to his voice it was clear
4. It has to do with the fact that Myles is a better musician! And that's FACTS! Witch would only increes my statement of beeing troue, that AB, or Myles if you wish are better if you look to facts!
5. I didn't say that they didn't have too work with the music, just said they're REALY lacking and that this would be a point in how Myles is a better musician!

Now, even if you're REALY bad, and I'm not talking Scott Stapp bad (sorry, but I had to, no hard feeling you guys), I'm talking like the worset of them all! You can still make it! You can still have people listening to you, comming to shows etc. Look at Sexpistols, how good were they, not at all, how good were the Ramones? Lousy! That didn't mean that they didn't get people to listen to them and thinking they were the biggest band ever to set foot on this earth BUT! That does NOT make them good musicians, and therefor AB is better then Stapp! You might like Stapp more but AB are better MUSICIANS!

[RoffeDH]

just thought i'd say the only fact in all of that is that stapp doesn't play the guitar... you're calling your opinions, like AB is 10 times better than stapp, facts which they aren't...

and just because myles is technically a better singer doesn't mean we have to like his voice... if it did we would all be listening to Celine Dion... what a terrible world that would be...

but that's all i wanted to say, and that as for your opinions i agree with them 100%... even that myles is a better singer... but that doesn't make them facts...

The 10 times better thing, it's facts, IF you look to the facts and compare the two. No Since Stapp is constantly repeting himself in his songs, that'll make him a bad songwriter, Myles does not.

The fact that Myles is a better singer, that's a fact, you might not like his voice that much, but he is a better singer. Yeah, but no :P We wouldn't be listening to Celin Di-f'cking-on who isn't the greatest singer, she's just a good singer, a pop singer... We would be listening to Freddie Murcury! AND WHAT AN AWSOME WORLD THAT WOULD BE!!! YEAH! :D

Yes, that does make it facts, if you look at the technique, and skipp the part of one of them having a more likeble voice witch ISN'T facts...

[Rawker]

roffe is right, yeh if you dont like myles voice, then don't listen to Ab then. I dont really like mercurys voice, i kno he is a great singer, but i can stand it so im smart enough to not listen to queen songs.
Nagpo, myles does want to play the guitar, and CAN mark even said with myles being able to do backing it allows him to put his potential on show.
If you dont like Ab, please f off and dont bother posting in the AB section. ur probably just looking for a fight coz Stapp is shit without the guys

[HuMaN~ClAy]

The 10 times better thing, it's facts, IF you look to the facts and compare the two. No Since Stapp is constantly repeting himself in his songs, that'll make him a bad songwriter, Myles does not.

The fact that Myles is a better singer, that's a fact, you might not like his voice that much, but he is a better singer. Yeah, but no :P We wouldn't be listening to Celin Di-f'cking-on who isn't the greatest singer, she's just a good singer, a pop singer... We would be listening to Freddie Murcury! AND WHAT AN AWSOME WORLD THAT WOULD BE!!! YEAH! :D

Yes, that does make it facts, if you look at the technique, and skipp the part of one of them having a more likeble voice witch ISN'T facts...

unless you can find and cite me a source that specificly says AB are 10 times better than Scott Stapp then it's not a fact... now, i have looked over at www.rollingstone.com and the average reader review for AB is 4.5/5 and the average for Scott Stapp is 3/5... given this poll is definitely affected by biased opinions, this is still a study reflecting the "goodness" of each. this shows that AB is only 1.5X better than scott stapp lol... this completely contradicts your hypothesis of AB being 10 times better so we can reject the null hypothesis...

if you have any information that proves otherwise i would like to see it... but i don't expect any.

and just so you know my opinion, like yours, is that AB is 10x better... if not more.

[RoffeDH]

unless you can find and cite me a source that specificly says AB are 10 times better than Scott Stapp then it's not a fact... now, i have looked over at www.rollingstone.com and the average reader review for AB is 4.5/5 and the average for Scott Stapp is 3/5... given this poll is definitely affected by biased opinions, this is still a study reflecting the "goodness" of each. this shows that AB is only 1.5X better than scott stapp lol... this completely contradicts your hypothesis of AB being 10 times better so we can reject the null hypothesis...

if you have any information that proves otherwise i would like to see it... but i don't expect any.

and just so you know my opinion, like yours, is that AB is 10x better... if not more.

Now, that is peoples opinions, not facts... Those polls are made so that you can vote on them AND people can vote several times, that manly shows who have the most fans, if I hated Stapp, witch I do :P I would vote against him I I was a total jackass and vice versa. And they are based on opinions not facts, so we can't say that people who've voted likes AB 1,5X more then Stapp, not that AB is 1,5X better then Stapp ;)

[HuMaN~ClAy]

how do you determine which musician is better from one another if it's not based off of the opinions of educated people in the area of music? music is not a quantitative variable, there's no such thing as a music-o-meter which can give you a number for an artist so that you can compare it to another artist. music is very subjective and it's up to listeners to form their own opinions on who is better than who. a poll of who people like is one of the only ways to compare artists, so i went to an educated source -- the rolling stone -- and analyzed one of their public polls. i realize this source is obviously biased but finding an unbiased source on this matter i would think is near impossible.

sorry but your accusations of AB being 10 times better than Scott Stapp is not a fact, it's your opinion. there must be some form of research -- like a poll -- to support it. there are very few facts related to music...

[nagpo]

this is pointless. im tired of talking about it. bye.

[Rawker]

thank F*ck he is finally going due to him realising Ab are better without stapp.
I borrowed my mates copy of tgd. and it SUCK yes thats my opinion but any one notice, There are intro solos? (trying to piss or Mark??) the songs All sound the same. and ALL the intros are long. yeh a long intro is good in some cases but he abused it.

[guitardude1985]

this is pointless. im tired of talking about it. bye.

Look, there's a big difference in just talking about your not so flattering view of alter bridge as oppsed to stapp. But, this is a message board where debate is wanted, just not half-asses antagonistic comments and blanket statements. You don't like alter bridge, but are a big stapp fan...fine. However try not to resort in retarted statements such as "alter bridge suck and stapp is 100 times better" kinda stuff.

[RoffeDH]

how do you determine which musician is better from one another if it's not based off of the opinions of educated people in the area of music? music is not a quantitative variable, there's no such thing as a music-o-meter which can give you a number for an artist so that you can compare it to another artist. music is very subjective and it's up to listeners to form their own opinions on who is better than who. a poll of who people like is one of the only ways to compare artists, so i went to an educated source -- the rolling stone -- and analyzed one of their public polls. i realize this source is obviously biased but finding an unbiased source on this matter i would think is near impossible.

sorry but your accusations of AB being 10 times better than Scott Stapp is not a fact, it's your opinion. there must be some form of research -- like a poll -- to support it. there are very few facts related to music...

Now, you can actually make a scientific research on who is the better on what, it's true, now I haven't done one since I don't have all the resources to do one, but just do give an example, Franc Sinatra (belive that's the way to spell it) is the best singer when it comes to be singen the right note (belive that was the case), that doesn't make him fun to listen to but that was made with science, polls on the other hand are people, who have no idea of what they're saying simply saying they like Stapp better then they like AB or vice versa, NOT who they think is the best musician... But I don't have any kind of reaserches done in the matter of who's better then who on the matter of AB vs Stapp... But I would be more then happy to do one.

I do actually have on statement from my former songcoach, he said "Those guys are among the best I've ever heard! That singer is probobly the best there is". Now it's easy for me to just say this, you don't even know who if I ever attended songlessons or not, if my songcoach is real, I could be saying that I have done this reaserch and so forth and you probobly wouldn't belive me...

YES! It's an opinion that AB is 10X better then Stapp, but seeing how AB's a band and Stapp's solo 4 persons togeather probobly are better then 1... And looking at Stapp who can't play the guitar or any other instrument for that matter of very poor if he can, AB is probobly 10X better then Stapp since they are 4 persons and Mark can REALY play the guitar, Myles can REALY sing and play the guitar well, Brian is pretty good at Bass (any one correct me if he's better or worse) and Scott can play numerouse instruments and is REALY good at drumms (correct me if I'm wrong on this one two)... Now, is AB 10X more musical than Stapp (one person)? Probobly is closer to the trouth then 1,5X better, don't you think?

[RoffeDH]

However try not to resort in retarted statements such as "alter bridge suck and stapp is 100 times better" kinda stuff.

:eek:
That's almost what I've been doing ;)

[HuMaN~ClAy]

:eek:
That's almost what I've been doing ;)

that's what i was trying to get at, didn't mean to start a fight with ya because i know we have the same view towards most things... it's just we all need to stop this AB vs Stapp thing, if you like one over the other then that's fine but it's not cool to tell people they don't know what they're talking about just because they don't like the same thing as you. There is no way to compare AB and Stapp to determine who is "better", that whole 1.5 times better thing i did was a joke just to show that if you're going to call your opinions facts you better back it up.

i'm an AB freak... but that doesn't mean i'm a stapp hater... i'm an active stapp listener.

sorry if i pissed you off Roffe, i know nagpo started the "my opinion is better than yours" theme in this thread, but i'm glad you realised you fought back at it with the same thing.

[RoffeDH]

You see... I didn't say he was an idiot (did I?), maybe I did... Any way... What I meant was that any idiot can hear that AB is more musical than Stapp, you are intiteled to the opinion that Stapp is better, I mean, I love Pink Floyed, but their not that technical, but people have said that they are "simple genius", that doesn't make it less simple... So just couse you're technical doesn't mean that you're fun to listen to... Get my point?

[RoffeDH]

http://www.digitaldreamdoor.com/pages/best_vocalists.html

You can see myles on that list but not Stapp, now this isn't a page that do research on how good they sing, they just look at what they have/can acomplish I guess since both Roger Waters and David Guilmour is higher then Myles and so is John Lennon, and they aren't that good vocalists... But according to this page Myles is one of the greatest rock vocalists of all times, not Stapp!!!

[HuMaN~ClAy]

and do you know how they come up with these lists??? they're based off the opinions of people who are educated in the field of music... Music is in the arts, it's not a science. you can't compare music quantitatively like you would reaction rates of different chemical processes to determine which one is better... Music is personal and the listener is the one who can choose who they like more.

These "facts" start as opinions.... they're not true "facts".

but that is an interesting list, nice to see Myles being recognized :)... Cornell #3 of all time, he's definitely my favorite singer to listen too.

[Creed7352]

actually, i remember voting for myles on that list myself :D

[RoffeDH]

Yes, I know that it's very hard to determin who is the better singer, but it's not impossible to do so without mixing the facts with opinions... Not impossible...

some one just needs to do so... When I read music on universal I'll do as my exam a compare of the two just to shut everyone up!

[Lunar Shadow]

all I can say is that if AB wants to sick around they better bring it on their next album (if there is one) because I for one was not impressed with ODR in the slightest the music was so-so and the vocals sucked ass.... MK's voice just doesn't go well with Tremonti's style of playing.

[Rawker]

and the vocals sucked ass.... MK's voice just doesn't go well with Tremonti's style of playing.
Have u ever been to an AB gig, coz if you have and your saying that. then by god u must have been staring at the wall.

[Lunar Shadow]

that is strickly an opinion of your's rawker....


however I will say that thoes retards in the band never even bothered comeing to where I am I mean come on its only the 6th largest area in the country (the SanFrancisco Bay area but no NOTHING so that makes them suck more if you can't even get enough people to see you play here that you don't even bother coming??? I mean what kinda band are you???

[HuMaN~ClAy]

if i recall correctly AB wasn't getting very good radio play in that area at all (i could be wrong, shitty memory sometimes), so if you're a new band starting out ur not going to want to waste your time going to places where nobody knows who you are and have an end result of bad attendance at shows.

[RoffeDH]

I for one think that Myles voice realy goes well with Marks way opf playing...
And if they don't get good radioplay, that doesn't make them suck... Many good bands haven't gotten radioplay at all in some areas...

[Creed7352]

radio today sucks dick. that is all.

[RoffeDH]

I'm with you Creed7352! Radio sucks, we have ONE good station here in Sweden... One that plays rock, all other stations play pop and stuff like that!