Creed's Windup Contract - Page 3

Higher_Desire · 05-23-2004, 12:11 AM

I just don't get it.

Why would Creed sign a new deal (if they indeed did) under the name of Creed if Creed wasn't going to be putting out more albums? If there are plans for more than one AlterBridge album, wouldn't Wind-Up make AlterBridge sign a contract? If AlterBridge is not under contract, as a seperate band, legal matters could severely screw things up and (legally speaking) they would not be an offically recognized band. A contract is needed to do that.

H-D

Bridge of Clay · 05-23-2004, 12:13 AM

It was signed before the split up.

Higher_Desire · 05-23-2004, 12:20 AM

But wouldn't a breakup force the contract to be null and void? Therefore making AB have to have another contract?

H-D

Echelon122 · 05-23-2004, 12:20 AM

It was not Creed's option to renew...it was Wind-Ups.

Higher_Desire · 05-23-2004, 12:22 AM

But they can't force the band to sign a contract. The band has to accept the offer and sign. A contract is an agreement. Not a one-sided way of forcing someone to stay under your control.

H-D

Echelon122 · 05-23-2004, 12:23 AM

Also, I'd be willing to bet, that rather than breach any existing contract, they re-negotiated with these projects to have them count towards the "Creed" total. But I also would bet there's a separate "Alter Bridge" contract, as well as a "Solo Stapp" one too....but they might be tied into the Creed one?

I'm just guessing...they might not have...who knows?!

No wonder Record companies don't usually make record deals available.

Echelon122 · 05-23-2004, 12:24 AM

Quote: (Originally Posted by Higher_Desire) But they can't force the band to sign a contract. The band has to accept the offer and sign. A contract is an agreement. Not a one-sided way of forcing someone to stay under your control.

H-D

However, if you have it in you contract that it's one sides option to renew....then they CAN force you to stay under that contract.

one reason many new bands will eventually SUE their lables to get OUT of their contracts.

WU's not dumb enough to let Creed get away from them.

Higher_Desire · 05-23-2004, 12:29 AM

Quote: (Originally Posted by Echelon122) WU's not dumb enough to let Creed get away from them.

Yet they're dumb enough to let them not stay together and do different stuff. That doesn't make much sense either. I know what you're getting is that ultimately they wouldn't want any of the guys sign under a different label for any reason, but by letting them be Alterbridge and Stapp, they are letting Creed go.

H-D

Trees of Wisdom · 05-23-2004, 12:30 AM

Quote: (Originally Posted by Higher_Desire) Yet they're dumb enough to let them not stay together and do different stuff. That doesn't make much sense either. I know what you're getting is that ultimately they wouldn't want any of the guys sign under a different label for any reason, but by letting them be Alterbridge and Stapp, they are letting Creed go.

H-D

They will make more money, though. Alter Bridge will do very well, assuming they are marketed well. Same goes for Scott Stapp.

Higher_Desire · 05-23-2004, 12:34 AM

Quote: (Originally Posted by Trees of Wisdom) They will make more money, though. Alter Bridge will do very well, assuming they are marketed well. Same goes for Scott Stapp.

Personally speaking, people hate Creed because they hate Scott Stapp. People who say they hate Creed may be able to deal with AB, and like them, however, only Creed fans would buy Stapp's album. Though that is a great number of people, ultimately, I don't think Stapp will be able to make it without the rest of the guys.

H-D

Trees of Wisdom · 05-23-2004, 12:35 AM

Quote: (Originally Posted by Higher_Desire) Personally speaking, people hate Creed because they hate Scott Stapp. People who say they hate Creed may be able to deal with AB, and like them, however, only Creed fans would buy Stapp's album. Though that is a great number of people, ultimately, I don't think Stapp will be able to make it without the rest of the guys.

H-D

Yeah me too. But there are always the "scottluvers" that for sure will buy his album.

Echelon122 · 05-23-2004, 12:41 AM

Quote: (Originally Posted by Higher_Desire) Yet they're dumb enough to let them not stay together and do different stuff. That doesn't make much sense either. I know what you're getting is that ultimately they wouldn't want any of the guys sign under a different label for any reason, but by letting them be Alterbridge and Stapp, they are letting Creed go.

H-D

But they'll still get their $$ from the Creed name and having control of those songs and albums. They COULD put a "greatest hits CD" out and the guys probably couldn't stop that if they wanted to.

By letting them do their various project and keeping them tied to the "Creed deal"...again, I'm sure there are separte contracts for AB and Stapp...they benifit more, and don't have to worry about them jumping lables. Stapp and AB could go to ANY Lable and get some success...but they're not competing that much on WU with other bands for support and backing.

I think a LOT of the inital sales of both albums will be Creed fans eager to see what gets put out there. Past that, I think it'll be the content of the albums that shows sales...I don't think "name" will have all that much to do with it...yeah it'll factor in, but I don't see it being a factor that tips scales like I did a few months ago.

Quote: Though that is a great number of people, ultimately, I don't think Stapp will be able to make it without the rest of the guys.

I'm inclined to agree with that.

Trees of Wisdom · 05-23-2004, 12:56 AM

Creed was declining. Weathered wasn't good and I think Creed's next album wouldn't have sold a lot. Good move on Wind-up's part.

Mr.CreedFreakTN · 05-23-2004, 01:12 AM

Quote: (Originally Posted by Trees of Wisdom) Creed was declining. Weathered wasn't good and I think Creed's next album wouldn't have sold a lot. Good move on Wind-up's part.

CREED WAS DECLINING. I don't know about you, but from every concert I attended (5) on the Weathered Tour they were all sold out. Not to mention all the awards Creed won from Weathered . I think we are going to have to agree to disagree.

Echelon122 · 05-23-2004, 01:18 AM

Quote: (Originally Posted by Mr.CreedFreakTN) CREED WAS DECLINING. I don't know about you, but from every concert I attended (5) on the Weathered Tour they were all sold out. Not to mention all the awards Creed won from Weathered . I think we are going to have to agree to disagree.

What concerts did you go to? I was at 8 that tour and the ONLY ones sold out that I was at were Milwaukee and St. Paul on the first leg (that whole leg sold out)...and then Chicago and Philly in December of 2002. Alpine Valley might have been, but with a GA lawn, you can't really tell...

I know for a fact Moline in August was not a sell out...the arena was half empty.

But I think overall they did well from the tour...weren't they like #8 or something for touring in 2002? But the attendce dropped off over the tour.

I agree with you on the awards.

05-23-2004, 12:11 AM	#31
Higher_Desire USER INFO » Status: Found Peace Posts: 8,631 Joined: Apr 2003 Currently: Offline	I just don't get it. Why would Creed sign a new deal (if they indeed did) under the name of Creed if Creed wasn't going to be putting out more albums? If there are plans for more than one AlterBridge album, wouldn't Wind-Up make AlterBridge sign a contract? If AlterBridge is not under contract, as a seperate band, legal matters could severely screw things up and (legally speaking) they would not be an offically recognized band. A contract is needed to do that. H-D __________________ Today I'm gonna try a little harder Gonna make every minute last longer Gonna learn to forgive and forget 'Cause we don't have long Gonna make the most of it Today I'm gonna love my enemies Reach out to somebody who needs me Make a change, make the world a better place 'Cause tomorrow could be one day too late --lyrics from "One Day Too Late" by Skillet from their new album "Awake"

05-23-2004, 12:13 AM	#32
Bridge of Clay USER INFO » Status: Tree of Wisdom Posts: 8,025 Joined: Sep 2002 Currently: Offline	It was signed before the split up. __________________ .:: "If people don't like guitar solos... then they're frikkin' stupid!" - Mark Tremonti ::.

05-23-2004, 12:20 AM	#33
Higher_Desire USER INFO » Status: Found Peace Posts: 8,631 Joined: Apr 2003 Currently: Offline	But wouldn't a breakup force the contract to be null and void? Therefore making AB have to have another contract? H-D __________________ Today I'm gonna try a little harder Gonna make every minute last longer Gonna learn to forgive and forget 'Cause we don't have long Gonna make the most of it Today I'm gonna love my enemies Reach out to somebody who needs me Make a change, make the world a better place 'Cause tomorrow could be one day too late --lyrics from "One Day Too Late" by Skillet from their new album "Awake"

05-23-2004, 12:20 AM	#34
Echelon122 USER INFO » Status: Broken Dream Posts: 167 Joined: Mar 2004 Currently: Offline	It was not Creed's option to renew...it was Wind-Ups. __________________ Peace, Erin I might be a newbie here, but I've been around a long time.

05-23-2004, 12:22 AM	#35
Higher_Desire USER INFO » Status: Found Peace Posts: 8,631 Joined: Apr 2003 Currently: Offline	But they can't force the band to sign a contract. The band has to accept the offer and sign. A contract is an agreement. Not a one-sided way of forcing someone to stay under your control. H-D __________________ Today I'm gonna try a little harder Gonna make every minute last longer Gonna learn to forgive and forget 'Cause we don't have long Gonna make the most of it Today I'm gonna love my enemies Reach out to somebody who needs me Make a change, make the world a better place 'Cause tomorrow could be one day too late --lyrics from "One Day Too Late" by Skillet from their new album "Awake"

05-23-2004, 12:23 AM	#36
Echelon122 USER INFO » Status: Broken Dream Posts: 167 Joined: Mar 2004 Currently: Offline	Also, I'd be willing to bet, that rather than breach any existing contract, they re-negotiated with these projects to have them count towards the "Creed" total. But I also would bet there's a separate "Alter Bridge" contract, as well as a "Solo Stapp" one too....but they might be tied into the Creed one? I'm just guessing...they might not have...who knows?! No wonder Record companies don't usually make record deals available. __________________ Peace, Erin I might be a newbie here, but I've been around a long time.

05-23-2004, 12:24 AM	#37
Echelon122 USER INFO » Status: Broken Dream Posts: 167 Joined: Mar 2004 Currently: Offline	Quote: (Originally Posted by Higher_Desire) But they can't force the band to sign a contract. The band has to accept the offer and sign. A contract is an agreement. Not a one-sided way of forcing someone to stay under your control. H-D However, if you have it in you contract that it's one sides option to renew....then they CAN force you to stay under that contract. one reason many new bands will eventually SUE their lables to get OUT of their contracts. WU's not dumb enough to let Creed get away from them. __________________ Peace, Erin I might be a newbie here, but I've been around a long time.

05-23-2004, 12:29 AM	#38
Higher_Desire USER INFO » Status: Found Peace Posts: 8,631 Joined: Apr 2003 Currently: Offline	Quote: (Originally Posted by Echelon122) WU's not dumb enough to let Creed get away from them. Yet they're dumb enough to let them not stay together and do different stuff. That doesn't make much sense either. I know what you're getting is that ultimately they wouldn't want any of the guys sign under a different label for any reason, but by letting them be Alterbridge and Stapp, they are letting Creed go. H-D __________________ Today I'm gonna try a little harder Gonna make every minute last longer Gonna learn to forgive and forget 'Cause we don't have long Gonna make the most of it Today I'm gonna love my enemies Reach out to somebody who needs me Make a change, make the world a better place 'Cause tomorrow could be one day too late --lyrics from "One Day Too Late" by Skillet from their new album "Awake"

05-23-2004, 12:30 AM	#39
Trees of Wisdom USER INFO » Status: Wound Up Posts: 1,106 Joined: Mar 2004 Currently: Offline	Quote: (Originally Posted by Higher_Desire) Yet they're dumb enough to let them not stay together and do different stuff. That doesn't make much sense either. I know what you're getting is that ultimately they wouldn't want any of the guys sign under a different label for any reason, but by letting them be Alterbridge and Stapp, they are letting Creed go. H-D They will make more money, though. Alter Bridge will do very well, assuming they are marketed well. Same goes for Scott Stapp. __________________ "It's all about the super jackpot." -Mark Tremonti

05-23-2004, 12:34 AM	#40
Higher_Desire USER INFO » Status: Found Peace Posts: 8,631 Joined: Apr 2003 Currently: Offline	Quote: (Originally Posted by Trees of Wisdom) They will make more money, though. Alter Bridge will do very well, assuming they are marketed well. Same goes for Scott Stapp. Personally speaking, people hate Creed because they hate Scott Stapp. People who say they hate Creed may be able to deal with AB, and like them, however, only Creed fans would buy Stapp's album. Though that is a great number of people, ultimately, I don't think Stapp will be able to make it without the rest of the guys. H-D __________________ Today I'm gonna try a little harder Gonna make every minute last longer Gonna learn to forgive and forget 'Cause we don't have long Gonna make the most of it Today I'm gonna love my enemies Reach out to somebody who needs me Make a change, make the world a better place 'Cause tomorrow could be one day too late --lyrics from "One Day Too Late" by Skillet from their new album "Awake"

05-23-2004, 12:35 AM	#41
Trees of Wisdom USER INFO » Status: Wound Up Posts: 1,106 Joined: Mar 2004 Currently: Offline	Quote: (Originally Posted by Higher_Desire) Personally speaking, people hate Creed because they hate Scott Stapp. People who say they hate Creed may be able to deal with AB, and like them, however, only Creed fans would buy Stapp's album. Though that is a great number of people, ultimately, I don't think Stapp will be able to make it without the rest of the guys. H-D Yeah me too. But there are always the "scottluvers" that for sure will buy his album. __________________ "It's all about the super jackpot." -Mark Tremonti

05-23-2004, 12:41 AM	#42
Echelon122 USER INFO » Status: Broken Dream Posts: 167 Joined: Mar 2004 Currently: Offline	Quote: (Originally Posted by Higher_Desire) Yet they're dumb enough to let them not stay together and do different stuff. That doesn't make much sense either. I know what you're getting is that ultimately they wouldn't want any of the guys sign under a different label for any reason, but by letting them be Alterbridge and Stapp, they are letting Creed go. H-D But they'll still get their $$ from the Creed name and having control of those songs and albums. They COULD put a "greatest hits CD" out and the guys probably couldn't stop that if they wanted to. By letting them do their various project and keeping them tied to the "Creed deal"...again, I'm sure there are separte contracts for AB and Stapp...they benifit more, and don't have to worry about them jumping lables. Stapp and AB could go to ANY Lable and get some success...but they're not competing that much on WU with other bands for support and backing. I think a LOT of the inital sales of both albums will be Creed fans eager to see what gets put out there. Past that, I think it'll be the content of the albums that shows sales...I don't think "name" will have all that much to do with it...yeah it'll factor in, but I don't see it being a factor that tips scales like I did a few months ago. Quote: Though that is a great number of people, ultimately, I don't think Stapp will be able to make it without the rest of the guys. I'm inclined to agree with that. __________________ Peace, Erin I might be a newbie here, but I've been around a long time.

05-23-2004, 12:56 AM	#43
Trees of Wisdom USER INFO » Status: Wound Up Posts: 1,106 Joined: Mar 2004 Currently: Offline	Creed was declining. Weathered wasn't good and I think Creed's next album wouldn't have sold a lot. Good move on Wind-up's part. __________________ "It's all about the super jackpot." -Mark Tremonti

05-23-2004, 01:12 AM	#44
Mr.CreedFreakTN USER INFO » Status: A Melody Posts: 407 Joined: Dec 2002 Currently: Offline	Quote: (Originally Posted by Trees of Wisdom) Creed was declining. Weathered wasn't good and I think Creed's next album wouldn't have sold a lot. Good move on Wind-up's part. CREED WAS DECLINING. I don't know about you, but from every concert I attended (5) on the Weathered Tour they were all sold out. Not to mention all the awards Creed won from Weathered . I think we are going to have to agree to disagree. __________________ I'm down on my knee's again with my face to the ground, as the tears roll down my cheeks can love, love be found dealing with the devil time and time again, please God in Heaven forgive for my sins....

05-23-2004, 01:18 AM	#45
Echelon122 USER INFO » Status: Broken Dream Posts: 167 Joined: Mar 2004 Currently: Offline	Quote: (Originally Posted by Mr.CreedFreakTN) CREED WAS DECLINING. I don't know about you, but from every concert I attended (5) on the Weathered Tour they were all sold out. Not to mention all the awards Creed won from Weathered . I think we are going to have to agree to disagree. What concerts did you go to? I was at 8 that tour and the ONLY ones sold out that I was at were Milwaukee and St. Paul on the first leg (that whole leg sold out)...and then Chicago and Philly in December of 2002. Alpine Valley might have been, but with a GA lawn, you can't really tell... I know for a fact Moline in August was not a sell out...the arena was half empty. But I think overall they did well from the tour...weren't they like #8 or something for touring in 2002? But the attendce dropped off over the tour. I agree with you on the awards. __________________ Peace, Erin I might be a newbie here, but I've been around a long time.

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