[uncertaindrumer]

Quote: (Originally Posted by Sincirr)

UD, I appreciate your answers to my stuff I said, but even if I gave U proof of the bible being witheld from the public to read and discern themselves, you would probably say that the source was unreliable or something so there's no point. I have a book right here in front of me. Bah! Has no chain action but I will work on that, cos I didnt get it from NOWHERE!

Most books on the reformation will attest to the fact that the church at the time was the authorised guardian and interpreter of the bible - interpretation i.e. meaning of the scriptures was held in the hands of the church heirarchy, and that the Christians were to accept and recieve those interpretations as the truth.

Point is that All Christians had to accept the official views of the church on matters of the text therein. Luther came along and challenged that by believing that the induvidual believer should have the right to read and discern its contents.

Through this belief, his views on the righteousness of God recieved through Christ Jesus found in the text of Romans, set many many many free from a doctrine that emphasised achieving, meriting and even downright purchasing eternal life and in this way, that church lost the central theme of the bible, and therefore, how could it be called the Christian Church??? he did us a favour.

Plus Jesus said to go forth into all the world and preach the good news to all, but to make the word spread, it would have to be translated into those "world"'s languages. The church at the time would not allow this. Supposedly Latin at the time was an elitist language, not for the common people, so to preach this good news to the poor, it would have to be translated! Again, he did us a favour.

You would be doing myself and Aussiecreeder a favour by withholding something though, your damning opinions of our denominations:

See what you are implying here?

The truth is, UD, that "The gates of Hell" are actually the doorways of religion itself. It kills the truth that Jesus came to give.

I think its sad that U think I am going to hell cos I dont think that you are. Mainly because of the scripture that Luther made readily available to the masses:

JOHN 3:16
For God soooooo [emphasis mine] loved the world that He gave His one and only Son, that whoever believes in Him shall not perish but have eternal life.

NOT cos of the Church denomination that you belong to! Hellno! or rather: Hell? NO!

I most certainly DO NOT think you are going to Hell. You are clearly a sinsere Christian and I would assume you will definitely be on your way to the Pearly Gates someday.

As for the Bible thing; I want to know wheat your source is. I do not immediately say it is unreliable just if it disagrees with my position. But you have not shown any sources yet so there surely aren't any reasons for me to believe it, and I have read plenty of books that have shown me how they WEREN'T chained up in the manner you are saying. (I mean, if you tell me your sources is "Roman Catholicism" or something ,THEN I wouldn't believe it, but I am rather sure you are more intelligent than to believe such an unscholarly book as that)

Also, the Church is STILL the interpreter of the Bible! Just like the Bible itself says "no scripture is a matter of private interpretation"!

What I meant by the One Church thing, is that Jesus obviously established a CHURCH. Now, are you going to honestly tell me He established the one you are in? I would hope so, because if He didn't, you are in the wrong Church, lol!