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Canuckfish · 10-02-2006, 09:44 AM

Quote: (Originally Posted by Lunar Shadow) What so you want the privlage of having it both ways?? sorry it doen't work like that besides depening on the world view the person is probably gonna assume one way or the other wich makes it awfuly convienient for you doen't it?

Either they exist or they do not. People are free to choose what they believe.

Quote: (Originally Posted by Lunar Shadow) A world view can be self refuting just as the bible is self refuting if you actually look and read the bible contradicts itself many many times over much as the christian world voew contradicts itself so you have a self refuting world view.

Merely stating this does not make it so. You will evaluate any apparent contradictions based on your presupposition that the Bible is NOT the infallible word of God. The Christian will evaluate any apparent contradictions based on their presupposition that the Bible IS the word of God. Your point is moot. We have to examine the validity of our presuppositions to reach any conclusion.

Quote: (Originally Posted by Lunar Shadow)
Point of contention here Logic and science and natualistic morality are all observable so they are not tottaly abstract they only seem abstract to the laymen but with some study you will find they are observable things in our world therefore comming back to a materialistic world view.

Please show me a law of logic or science.

Quote: (Originally Posted by Lunar Shadow) Where doe you get the foundations of logic?? please do tell

http://www.proofthatgodexists.org/ho...ccount-for.php

Quote: (Originally Posted by Lunar Shadow)
I am not asking to be convinced I am asking for proof there is a difference.

I have given you proof. The proof that God exists is that without Him you couldn't prove anything. You want to be CONVINCED that that proof is valid.

Quote: (Originally Posted by Lunar Shadow) no you don't get off that easy there... you're gonna have to prove the existance of god if you are gonna have me construct an arguemnt that big.

I have shown you the proof of God's existence. Rather than suggest that the argument supporting the validity of your human reason, without using human reason, is going to be 'Big,' just think about it first. You cannot do it. You may try if you like though.

Quote: (Originally Posted by Lunar Shadow) Why Christianity? why believe in jesus? he is not unique in any way his stroy is a rehash of many dying and rising god over 1000 years before him. but you wouldn't know anything about that would you?

For one, because Christianity is the ONLY worldview that provides a logical foundation for universal, abstract, invariant laws. You may posit another. I will be pleased to refute it.

Quote: (Originally Posted by Lunar Shadow) meaning Peace be with you
I do not wish harm to come to anyone no matter how heated a debate gets I may get frustrated but I wish no harm on anyone... but I can not say the same about other religions who order the death of Atheists and blasphemers and disobedient children and so on and so on.

You realize that this is a nice sentiment but a meaningless statement coming from an atheist. How can an abstract concept 'be with' anybody in your worldview?

Quote: (Originally Posted by Lunar Shadow) I try to refrain from using ad-hom attacks in debate it is pointless and get the debate nowhere I hope the same form you.... but if I am not in a debate I will let my feelings of frustration be known. venting on a fourm where a debate between us is not happening is something I see as fair game.. sorry if you take offense to the language that is how I talk but per request for a few here I refrain form using it in debate and on most sections of the board.

You directed me to a forum where you called me a pretty low name. I have decided to answer some of your objections, but really after that, I certainly was not obliged to.

Cheers,

Sye

10-02-2006, 09:44 AM	#25
Canuckfish USER INFO » Status: Illusion Posts: 17 Joined: Sep 2006 Currently: Offline	Re: I found this interesting. Quote: (Originally Posted by Lunar Shadow) What so you want the privlage of having it both ways?? sorry it doen't work like that besides depening on the world view the person is probably gonna assume one way or the other wich makes it awfuly convienient for you doen't it? Either they exist or they do not. People are free to choose what they believe. Quote: (Originally Posted by Lunar Shadow) A world view can be self refuting just as the bible is self refuting if you actually look and read the bible contradicts itself many many times over much as the christian world voew contradicts itself so you have a self refuting world view. Merely stating this does not make it so. You will evaluate any apparent contradictions based on your presupposition that the Bible is NOT the infallible word of God. The Christian will evaluate any apparent contradictions based on their presupposition that the Bible IS the word of God. Your point is moot. We have to examine the validity of our presuppositions to reach any conclusion. Quote: (Originally Posted by Lunar Shadow) Point of contention here Logic and science and natualistic morality are all observable so they are not tottaly abstract they only seem abstract to the laymen but with some study you will find they are observable things in our world therefore comming back to a materialistic world view. Please show me a law of logic or science. Quote: (Originally Posted by Lunar Shadow) Where doe you get the foundations of logic?? please do tell http://www.proofthatgodexists.org/ho...ccount-for.php Quote: (Originally Posted by Lunar Shadow) I am not asking to be convinced I am asking for proof there is a difference. I have given you proof. The proof that God exists is that without Him you couldn't prove anything. You want to be CONVINCED that that proof is valid. Quote: (Originally Posted by Lunar Shadow) no you don't get off that easy there... you're gonna have to prove the existance of god if you are gonna have me construct an arguemnt that big. I have shown you the proof of God's existence. Rather than suggest that the argument supporting the validity of your human reason, without using human reason, is going to be 'Big,' just think about it first. You cannot do it. You may try if you like though. Quote: (Originally Posted by Lunar Shadow) Why Christianity? why believe in jesus? he is not unique in any way his stroy is a rehash of many dying and rising god over 1000 years before him. but you wouldn't know anything about that would you? For one, because Christianity is the ONLY worldview that provides a logical foundation for universal, abstract, invariant laws. You may posit another. I will be pleased to refute it. Quote: (Originally Posted by Lunar Shadow) meaning Peace be with you I do not wish harm to come to anyone no matter how heated a debate gets I may get frustrated but I wish no harm on anyone... but I can not say the same about other religions who order the death of Atheists and blasphemers and disobedient children and so on and so on. You realize that this is a nice sentiment but a meaningless statement coming from an atheist. How can an abstract concept 'be with' anybody in your worldview? Quote: (Originally Posted by Lunar Shadow) I try to refrain from using ad-hom attacks in debate it is pointless and get the debate nowhere I hope the same form you.... but if I am not in a debate I will let my feelings of frustration be known. venting on a fourm where a debate between us is not happening is something I see as fair game.. sorry if you take offense to the language that is how I talk but per request for a few here I refrain form using it in debate and on most sections of the board. You directed me to a forum where you called me a pretty low name. I have decided to answer some of your objections, but really after that, I certainly was not obliged to. Cheers, Sye