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Yes, Revelation does say not to add or take away from scripture. But there are two things you must remember: first, the Bible is not arranged in chronological order. When the Romans arranged it, they did it in order of what they thought was important. Hence, after the five gospels they had (Matthew, Mark, Luke, John, Acts of the Apostles) they put the book of the Romans. With that being historically true, isn't it true that any book of the bible written after it would therefore be wrong? Also, what has also been said (by someone who was NOT Mormon, and I can't remember his name, but he was a Bible scholar) was that John could be talking about that if HIS teachings were changed. He was shown many things by the Lord (especially in Revelation) and if those things are changed or left out, then hellfire would rain upon us. H-D :pimp: |
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what you've said there at the end adds up and i'll give you that but the rest just doesn't do it for me at all. so a "burning in your bosom" will tell the truth? what if i have a burning in my bosom to go and rob a bank? to become a muslim? the bible generally is against making decisions on feelings and the love throughout the bible for instance is more of a decision based upon actions, rather than warm and fuzzy feelings (although they're excluded). what makes the burning of your bosom any more legimate than anyone elses? feelings are totally subjective and can't be tested for any evidence. at least the belief in God is a rational decision because life without some form of higher power i'm sure you would agree is laughable. so if the book of mormon adds to a mormon's spirtual walk isn't the bible sufficient for that? doesn't the bible claim to the inspired word of god and sufficient for all teaching? is a mormon without the book of mormon or who doesn't recongise its authority worse off or even a true mormon? |
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So what about the Muslim extremists (suicide bombers) who say what they're doing is right? They claim that what they are doing is right because they are killing for God (Allah). Now by what we as Christians believe, they'd go to hell because we're not supposed to kill. But they think they're going to heaven. It's God's judgement. Not ours. So do you mean to tell me that you've never had a feeling that the Bible was true based solely on what you've read in it or your faith in it? If you did have that feeling, how did you know where it came from? Quote:
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A Mormon without the BoM or recognize it's authority? What do you mean by that? All Mormons have the BoM, and if they don't recognize an authority, they wouldn't be a member. H-D :pimp: |
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Its easy to draw a conclusion that muslim extremists are wrong in taking innocent life in their quest to be accepted by Allah but what about socially accepted religions. One can easily have a "burning in their bosom" to become a buddhist, hindu, muslim, jew or any of the world's main religions. They all feel its right and are moral people but based on feelings you can't say which one is right. Only one can be right and they all have the burning in their bosom. Yes I do feel that christianity is the right path but that doesn't help your case. We both have a "burning in our bosom" and yet only one of us can be right or perhaps we are both wrong. Having no god is illogical because there must have being something to start whatever process took place, to create the matter and life and its ecosystems are way too complex for no creator. The bible is the most correct book? So by most correct it has error? Where are the errors? If there any errors the whole book is basically useless as it proves that its not an inspired book and is not any better than the Quran for instance. BTW if something is void of holes then it doesn't have any holes. |
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H-D :pimp: |
the bible claims to be in the inspired word of God and yet you say its has errors. that means the whole premise is built on a fraud and it is no better than any other book. please point out what you believe are errors or contradictions and why someone should accept the BOM over the bible where they contradict.
everything has feelings about what is right but not everyone can be right, surely that has to be obvious. lets for arguements sake pretend that the islamic god is the one and only god. if he claims that all who reject him will go to hell and we have because we're not muslims then what would our fate be? our works are not enough and do nothing to bring us closer to god. the NT in particular makes it clear its salvation by grace through faith not works. jesus describes those who say "we cast out demons.....etc" and yet he saids "depart i do not know you". one can sincere and yet sincerly wrong and the bible seems to say clearly they will pay for that wilful ignorance. you really need to point out specific areas in the bible that are clearly wrong i think....... |
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All of my references were King James version. H-D :pimp: |
salvation is by faith although james rightly clarifies that if there are no works then there is no salvation. however it is a VERY important distinction that works do NOT save a person.
None [of them] can by any means redeem his brother, nor give to God a ransom for him: (For the redemption of their soul [is] precious, and it ceaseth for ever:) Psalms 49:7-8 *A Song of degrees for Solomon.* Except the Lord build the house, they labour in vain that build it: except the Lord keep the city, the watchman waketh [but] in vain. [It is] vain for you to rise up early, to sit up late, to eat the bread of sorrows: [for] so he giveth his beloved sleep. Psalms 127:1-2 I have seen all the works that are done under the sun; and, behold, all [is] vanity and vexation of spirit. Ecclesiastes 1:14 Put me in remembrance: let us plead together: declare thou, that thou mayest be justified. Isaiah 43:26 I will declare thy righteousness, and thy works; for they shall not profit thee. Isaiah 57:12 But we are all as an unclean [thing], and all our righteousnesses [are] as filthy rags; and we all do fade as a leaf; and our iniquities, like the wind, have taken us away. Isaiah 64:6 They shall cast their silver in the streets, and their gold shall be removed: their silver and their gold shall not be able to deliver them in the day of the wrath of the Lord: they shall not satisfy their souls, neither fill their bowels: because it is the stumblingblock of their iniquity. Ezekiel 7:19 Therefore, thou son of man, say unto the children of thy people, The righteousness of the righteous shall not deliver him in the day of his transgression: as for the wickedness of the wicked, he shall not fall thereby in the day that he turneth from his wickedness; neither shall the righteous be able to live for his [righteousness] in the day that he sinneth. When I shall say to the righteous, [that] he shall surely live; if he trust to his own righteousness, and commit iniquity, all his righteousnesses shall not be remembered; but for his iniquity that he hath committed, he shall die for it. Again, when I say unto the wicked, Thou shalt surely die; if he turn from his sin, and do that which is lawful and right; [If] the wicked restore the pledge, give again that he had robbed, walk in the statutes of life, without committing iniquity; he shall surely live, he shall not die. None of his sins that he hath committed shall be mentioned unto him: he hath done that which is lawful and right; he shall surely live. Yet the children of thy people say, The way of the Lord is not equal: but as for them, their way is not equal. When the righteous turneth from his righteousness, and committeth iniquity, he shall even die thereby. But if the wicked turn from his wickedness, and do that which is lawful and right, he shall live thereby. Ezekiel 33:12-19 O my God, incline thine ear, and hear; open thine eyes, and behold our desolations, and the city which is called by thy name: for we do not present our supplications before thee for our righteousnesses, but for thy great mercies. Daniel 9:18 For I say unto you, That except your righteousness shall exceed [the righteousness] of the scribes and Pharisees, ye shall in no case enter into the kingdom of heaven. If someone is saved by works then there is no need for grace. Furthermore what would be the point of Jesus dying on the cross if we can save ourselves. Jesus then ceases to be the saviour and we become the saviour becaues we are doing the work and becoming acceptable to God. Don't you think its a little arrogant to take this stance? Also Hebrews 11 documents great men and women of faith such as Abraham and Noah and repeatedly saids "by faith they were saved" when they obeyed. Their obedience was the proof of their faith but its not what saved them. There is no problem in Jesus being baptized because baptism does not save but is a public profession of faith and Jesus obeyed God and humbled himself to John the Baptist by immersing himself in that river. |
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How can you dispute those verses that as clearly as day say "Faith without works is dead."? Quote:
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H-D :pimp: |
yeah we're going around in circles but in your reply just now you stated no your works don't save you and then later on said its not faith that saves you. what is it? anyhow we're not getting anywhere........i'm not disputing faith without works is dead. what i am disputing is that works save because they clearly do not. i thought it was a relatively simple concept......
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H-D :pimp: |
no this thread will not answer what came first the chicken or the egg? neither will it tell if God is dead. instead there are much bigger questions......
1.Why does Iceland have a mild climate while Greenland is covered with ice and makes Alaska look like Florida? In history, green was white and white was green. 2.Did Adam and Eve have navals? guess not... but you never know, ask the CIA 3.Why does Adam cop all the blame for the first sin? Wasen't his wife who did it first? Is it all part of a feminist conspiracy to get rid of men forever? :eek: Feminist conspriacy's piss me off! 4.If Adam went fishing instead of talking to his wife would the world be a better place? no, we'd all be fishing now instead of talking to our wifes how she shouldn't buy that couch with the last money you have for groceries (don't mind spelling) and other life supplies. :D 5.Why do women go to the toilet in pairs? they're women, what more to say? 6.Why do they go shopping and not buy anything? see above. 7.Why won't Lindsay Lohan return my calls, emails or agree to go on that date? who in godsname is Lindsay Lohan :confused: P.S. did ya miss me ppl? i havn't been around in a long time... :o |
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H-D :pimp: |
Why do men have nipples? They don't serve any practical purpose considering i've never met a man who has being able to pass milk through them lol. Oh and Higher Desire it looks we agree......I think. :)
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Also there's the whole theory of we all start life in the womb as female, and men are just more evolved females, but science has pretty much proven that false. Quote:
H-D :pimp: |
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