Which issue irks you the most?

[Read JDM]

Which social issue irks you the most? What's the one issue you wish would just go away? It doesn't matter what your opinion is on that issue, just pick an issue that you wish wasn't discussed so often.

I'll go first: Abortion.

Now, personally, I don't agree with abortion, but again, that's besides the point of this thread. The reason I'd like the issue to go away is because it's already been decided in a court of law in favor of abortions being legal, and politicos who campaign on this issue are really only campaigning on an issue they can't (or won't) change either which way. They're campaigning on it, in my mind, because it's an issue that riles up people on both sides.

Which issue would you pick? And again, this isn't meant to be a discussion of which side is right or wrong (just clarifying that because I'm figuring it'll get to that point eventually).

[JenRN]

You REALLY want to know what irks me???

Welfare!!!!!

I personally get MAD:mad: as hell when I see people at the grocery store paying for there food in food stamps then giving the cashier a $50.00 bill to pay for their beer and cigerettes and they are wearing fancy clothes and drive off in a new car!!!! That really pisses me off !!!! I have worked hard my entire life and because some one decides to have 4-5 kids on their own they get rewarded by the govenment with housing and food???
THIS IS SEPERATE FROM VETS,ELDERLY AND DISABILITY!!! PLEASE UNDER STAND THIS!!!! Those above people who get everything for free and still expect more and more, I see thousands of dollars in my paycheck going to this!! If they get help at first o.k. but.... there needs to be a limit!!!:madder:

[Read JDM]

Originally posted by JenRN
I see people at the grocery store paying for there food in food stamps then giving the cashier a $50.00 bill to pay for their beer and cigerettes and they are wearing fancy clothes and drive off in a new car!

You haven't seen it that extreme, have you? Yikes.

[TeriB19]

I have. I totally agree with Jen. I see people in Atlantic City all the time paying with food stamps and driving away in their Lincoln Navigators or new Mercedes. It is very annoying. The system was a good idea in theory, but now it's out of control. Clinton tried to straighten it out with limits on how long people could stay on welfare and fed. assistance programs, but it's still out of hand.

[Read JDM]

Yeah, I personally don't agree with the welfare mess, I just haven't encountered anyone in fancy clothes and cars paying with food stamps. Not that I doubt it. This country is chock full of people who take advantage of hard-working, tax-paying schmucks like myself.

[TeriB19]

And that just pisses me off. :mad: I work hard, I pay my taxes and I carry my own weight in this world AND I help foot the bill for some girl who is getting paid by the government for every kid she pops out.

[Read JDM]

I'm not going into specifics or anything, but yesterday, I received a hard-earned bonus check at work for a very significant amount of money. The government took about forty cents on the dollar. It's just ridiculous. The government didn't wake up at 6:30 a.m. and sit at my cubicle all day. The government didn't spend the last nine months working its ass off in hopes of having enough money to buy a life for itself -- I did. The thing that gets me the most is that they waste so much of the money they took from me. All they do is throw money at problems and hope the problems go away. It's ridiculous.

[Unforgiven Fan]

what is irking me...mmmm

I am tired of some religious folks and organizations that bash, exclude and try to hold down atheists just becase we do not beleive in a god and we are a minority in the whole religious/non-religious world and they think they can push us around and tape up are mouths when we want to speak and say our opinions are worthless...mmm that sounds kind of fimiliar......

[JenRN]

Back to the welfare thing... Yes I have seen that many times and it really pisses me off!!!!!! It drives me crazy when I get my pay-check and see how much is taken out for people like that!!!! It is sooo out of control!!!! The aethiest thing I am not touching!

[Lady Valkyrie]

you know what irks me? People who make fun of or condemn those on welfare who are obviously ignorant of the whole thing.

I have been a recipient of welfare many times. There were times that it couldn't be helped. It was either welfare or prostitution or dealing drugs.

And let me say that because of my personal experience I do KNOW how the system works.

For one thing, it is FEDERAL law that you can only buy food items with foodstamps. You cannot even purchase a box of baking soda that is packaged as a box where the sides tear off so it can be used as a deodorizer for the refrigerator. You have to buy the traditional box of baking soda for it to be considered a food item.

Also, welfare isn't a free ride any longer. You have to work 40 hours a week at a place of employment at the Welfare offices choice in order to recieve cash assistance. I recieved $461 in cash and $400 in foodstamps a month along with a medical card for me and my 3 children. I also had to pay a co-payment of $50 for partially welfare paid daycare for my 3 kids. My rent was $450 a month plus water, electric, trash, household supplies, school supplies and clothes. Also I was supposed to recieve $300 a month in child support. When my bum ex-husband would pay it the state would take it away from me. Why? Because I had to pay them back for every penny that I recieved in cash assistance... that doesn't include the foodstamps though. So basically I was working 40 hours a week at various places like a secretary/janitor/kitchen aid for the local Senior Center or as an office aid/Janitor at a local drug and alcohol counseling center where I also recieved counseling. In spite of me working for my welfare check I had to repay the system their money in the form of my children's child support check. Even after I was off of welfare and had a job I still didn't recieve their child support checks until like 6 months afterwards... because they requier every red cent paid back to them. And the only way a woman is exempt from working off the welfare check is if she has a baby under 1 year of age. Or if she is married to a man who is on the case file then he would be the one reqired to work. It has been known for both man and woman of a family to work off the welfare check as to split up the time and make it easier for at least one of the spouses to find a job. Also in some states even if you don't recieve a welfare check but only foodstamps you may be required to work off the foodstamps as well. And you don't have to he unemployed to recieve medical insurance assistance from the welfare... a blue collar worker can recieve foodstamps and medical insurance assistance from welfare. So please be advised that I paid for most of what I got in welfare back to the system at the expense of my children's child support... you didn't pay for all of my welfare. Don't be so arrogant and condescending as to even suggest it. Also I have held many jobs in my lifetime. I also have paid my share of taxes to help fund such things as welfare.

So you see all of you are like way off on your stereotyping of welfare recipiants. The system was very corrupt back in the 1980's however, welfare reform is here and it's here to stay. You people should be more informed of how things work before you open up your mouth. And I'm trying to be as diplomatic as I can about this... but man that really offended me and hurt me to see such misinformed people.

Now go ahead crucify me... I know you want to.

:P

[Read JDM]

But you're not suggesting that someone on welfare should be able to be unemployed, are you? I don't think that you are or anything, but, theoretically speaking, if that's what you were implying then that would be the point of the problems stated above. You know what I mean?

[Lady Valkyrie]

Excuse me again you are making mere assumptions... you are not informed of how the actual system works. THE WELFARE SYSTEM REQUIRES YOU LOOK FOR A JOB AND THEY ONLY ALLOW YOU TO BE ON CASH ASSISTANCE FOR 24 MONTHS THAT'S IT! I had to show proof every week that I looked for a job... in fact it was required that I show 12 copies of applications of employment and the signature and title of the person with whom I gave my application to.

[Lady Valkyrie]

Also they make one get their GED if they haven't graduated high school and that counts toward the 40 hours a week you have to work for your check. They also put you through a regmen of tests to see what kind of job you would be good at... take all of your interests into consideration... and urge you to take some college courses or something.

[TeriB19]

Lady V, I am not speaking for everyone here, just me. I am not condemning you or crucifying you. I am condemning the people that I have seen first hand abusing the system. I did not direct my post at you specifically, so please don't take everything I said personally. I am annoyed by the people who find every way they can to get around the system so that they can continue to stay at home, drink, do drugs, live a lifestyle that they cannot afford with my tax money.

[Lady Valkyrie]

Teri it just all sounded so generalized and stereotypical to me... that';s what offended me.


You know what never mind. I'm sorry if I came off as harsh It just hurt to see such generalizations. Just never mind. *sighs*

[Read JDM]

No, Lady V, I wasn't making an assumption of how the system works, I was asking if you thought that someone on welfare shouldn't have to look for a job. That's all.

[JenRN]

Holy Smokes!!!!!! Sure did not want to hurt anyone's feelings!! I agree with Teri there are soooo many people who abuse the system BADLY obviously LADY you were not one of them.... but the question remains.. how can it not bother you when you see these people paying in food stamps and giving the cashier $$$$ for beer etc... I have seen so many people for the past 10 years going into stores with Starter jackets, Nike $100.00 shoes and driving away in Honda Accords!!!! Those are the people I am talking about!!!!!!:mad:

[TeriB19]

I know I see it every day. I work in Atlantic City, and it is an incredible contrast. If you are on the boardwalk it's all glitz and glamour of the casinos, but go two blocks off the boardwalk and you have the sleazy side, the ghettos, the massage parlors, the adult book stores. And there are a lot of downtrodden people who really can use the system to better themselves. But then you have the "Unemployed" welfare recipients (whose real profession is the drug trade but you can't put THAT down on the application) who go into the Pathmark and buy their milk and eggs with the foodstamps in their leather jackets, Coach bags and Air Jordan shoes. Then you watch them go out into the parking lot and drive off in their Cadillacs or BMW's. Lady V, I know this is not you, so please don't take offense, but it's seeing this all the time that really pisses me off. Maybe it doesn't happen in all areas but here in South Jersey, we see it all the time.

[luvscott4ever]

I've seen that side Teri...a loongg time ago, when I was pregnant with Anna...My loser ex and I had to get MA so I would have a hospital to have her in...and as we sat there waiting to see someone a guy was bragging to another guy how he got $600 a month and how he doubled it every month selling coke!! I wanted to go over and KNOCK HIM OUT!!!

[TeriB19]

See that's what I'm talking about. The losers who take advantage of the system to a fault only make it bad for those who truly need it. Anyway, that's what really irks me.

Oh yeah, and everytime I travel anywhere long distance, why is there ALWAYS road work, 4 lanes of traffic cut down to one? That just pisses me off sometimes.

[Altair]

Protecting Marriage


What a crock this topic is! Same sex marriages. I thought this was a free country and yet people are trying to take away our freedom of love. Pathetic.

[Altair]

Another things that stupifies me is being able to try children in the court of law as adults. Uh, hello, I thought you weren't an adult until the age of 18 or 21 depending on whether or not we think you're responsible enough to drink even though we think you're responsible enough to vote and die for our country in the military, and responsible enough to drive at 16. What a bunch of contradictions in our society.

It's a good thing I know how to take deep breaths and let go of such silliness.

[Steve]

Originally posted by Altair
Another things that stupifies me is being able to try children in the court of law as adults.  Uh, hello, I thought you weren't an adult until the age of 18 or 21 depending on whether or not we think you're responsible enough to drink even though we think you're responsible enough to vote and die for our country in the military, and responsible enough to drive at 16.  What a bunch of contradictions in our society.

It's a good thing I know how to take deep breaths and let go of such silliness.

What' s your stance on this issue? Are you against trying people under the age of 18 or 21 as an adult, or are you for lowering the "adult age" to 16 ?

Personally, I am all for trying children as adults in court... if the crime(s) committed deserve it.

I don't know how many of you follow the news but a few months back in my own home city of Milwaukee a group of kids brutally beat a man to death with broom handles, shovels, tree branches, and other objects. You can read the story here:

http://stacks.msnbc.com/news/816496.asp

I didn't read that whole article so i don't know how indepth it is, but here in Milwaukee, we heard all the information regarding what happened. Apparently, the boy threw an egg at the man who later passed away. He became upset and punched the boy who threw the egg. Within minutes a mob of children chased him down, threw him to the ground and beat him. He later died.

They interviewed all of the kids who were charged in this case and just about all of them are uneducated. They gave reasons like "I didn't think he would die" - this is complete bull shit (excuse me). What do you think is going to happen when you hit someone over the head with a shovel over 10 times, having blood splatter onto the ceiling of a deck from a man laying on the ground. These kids DESERVE to be tried as adults. Why should we send them to a "detention center" where they get special treatment for 2 years until they turn 18 and can be released into society again? They commited murder and deserve to be tried for it. I am a firm believer of "do the crime, do the time."

[Steve]

Another issue which stems from the above has to do with people in this country, and the welfare system as mentioned earlier.

Everyday on the news there's some sort of violence, whether it be a shooting, stabbing, drive by, etc. And the people involved in these acts are getting younger and younger. People blame the government for not offering programs for their youth to be a part of. When I was growing up, I NEVER had any "government program" to give me something to do. I hung out with friends during the day and came home to my family. I never once sat around with nothing to do because there wasn't enough after school activities in my area or because there wasn't a YMCA down the block from me. We either found something to do outside or we stayed inside and played. It was simple as that. And if I couldn't find something to do, my mom or dad WOULD FIND ME SOMETHING to do (granted it usually wouldn't be something fun).

The problem all stems to the fact that children now-a-days don't have a family to rely on for support. Children wander the streets at all hours of the day, don't attend school, get involved in things they shouldn't, etc. If I was out past 6:00pm I'd be in so much trouble when I got home it wasn't funny. Kids now are out on the streets at 2:00AM!!! And this is blamed on the "fact" that there is nothing for the children to do. People say "if there was an activity for my child to get involved in, they wouldn't be out on the streets" - THEY WOULDN'T BE ON THE STREETS IF YOU DID YOUR JOB AS A PARENT. People in this country need to start taking responsibility for their actions rather than looking to blame someone or something else. That's the problem with our socitey today!!

I am grateful for my mom and dad for how they raised me. I was home at 6:00pm and in bed at 10:00pm. I did my homework before going out, I sat with them and learned to read, write, and speak correctly. They took responsibility for me, and I am going somewhere with myself ( at least I think I am ;) )... and I see the same thing with all of my friends.

Bottom line is if people start taking responsibility for their actions and stop looking around to others, this world would be a better place to live in.

[luvscott4ever]

I live in Minnesota so we're practically neighbors Steve, and I heard about that on the radio...I couldn't believe it!! And I'm with you!!! Just like the sniper kid, I hope he get what's coming to him too...even as teenagers they should be smart enough to know right from wrong and I truly believe in "An eye for an eye"..Atleast if we put these people away they can't hurt or kill anymore!!

[luvscott4ever]

Originally posted by Steve

THEY WOULDN'T BE ON THE STREETS IF YOU DID YOUR JOB AS A PARENT. People in this country need to start taking responsibility for their actions rather than looking to blame someone or something else. That's the problem with our socitey today!!

Bottom line is if people start taking responsibility for their actions and stop looking around to others, this world would be a better place to live in.

:clap: :clap: :clap: AMEN TO THAT STEVE!!!!!

[JenRN]

I totally agree Steve!!!!!! What are you my long lost brother I always wished I had??? I was raised the same way and I totally agree about kids being charged as adults!!! Hey I lived in SNIPER ALLEY!!!!!!! 2 people were shot in the town I work in Fredericksburg Va, Now that one of the snipers was under age it is opening a whole new issue when the only issue is THEY MURDERED 10 PEOPLE!!!!! Do you actually think this kid had "no idea " what he was doing? I totally agree with parents taking resonsibility, hey you choose to have kids raise them properly!!!! That is why I am a member of Scott Stapp's foundation and would give money and time to help this issue out!!!!!!!

[Dogstar]

Steve, you hit the nail on the head. I think people have children because it's the thing to do. They spend so much chasing the almighty $$$ that they have no time to teach their children right from wrong. It's been proven in study after study that kids need and want boundaries no matter what they tell you. Parents these days expect everyone else, schools, government, to do the work THEY should be doing. I get so annoyed at this one TV commercial for *family night* where you're supposed to *get together* one day a week for games and family time. In my house growing up, EVERY night was family night. I could go on forever on this topic, but I'll spare ya all. I agree, with you all that if these kids are doing adult crimes, let them face the adult music.

[Altair]

Originally posted by Steve
<b> These kids DESERVE to be tried as adults. Why should we send them to a "detention center" where they get special treatment for 2 years until they turn 18 and can be released into society again? They commited murder and deserve to be tried for it. I am a firm believer of "do the crime, do the time." </b>

My point simply is, they're not adults. I'm not defending them, just laughing at our ability to be so illogical and contradictive. I mean, you want to try a 10year old as an adult. Well, maybe it would help if they were an adult, but they're not. Helllllooooooo. Is anybody out there?

Where do you draw the line? You mentioned 16 year olds. Try them as adults since they're only 2 years away from being adults. Doesn't seem to unreasonable. But what about 15 year olds, 10 year olds, 5 year olds, 3 year olds. Where exactly do you draw the line? It seems to me that the logical and best way to draw the line is where the law has drawn the line. People are officially adults at the age of 18. Simple.

[TeriB19]

Originally posted by Steve
<b> People blame the government for not offering programs for their youth to be a part of. When I was growing up, I NEVER had any "government program" to give me something to do. I hung out with friends during the day and came home to my family. I never once sat around with nothing to do because there wasn't enough after school activities in my area or because there wasn't a YMCA down the block from me. We either found something to do outside or we stayed inside and played. It was simple as that. And if I couldn't find something to do, my mom or dad WOULD FIND ME SOMETHING to do (granted it usually wouldn't be something fun).

People say "if there was an activity for my child to get involved in, they wouldn't be out on the streets" - THEY WOULDN'T BE ON THE STREETS IF YOU DID YOUR JOB AS A PARENT. People in this country need to start taking responsibility for their actions rather than looking to blame someone or something else. That's the problem with our socitey today!!

</b> I'm with you on this issue, Steve. I was raised the same way. We hung out at friend's houses, the game room, took walks on the boardwalk at night etc. We made our fun without getting into trouble. We didn't have government programs but it didn't cause us to go out and find trouble to get into. We had a family dinner together every night. Homework was done and if you wanted to go out, you had to be home by 9. Later as I got older but by then, I was old enough to know right from wrong because that's how my single mother taught me. And as a mother myself, I'm getting my kids into as much as possible. My oldest is involved in swimming, soccer and Girl Scouts. If the government doesn't offer programs, the Township will, if they don't, you ACTIVELY seek out activities for your children to take part in. Idle hands are the devil's playground (or something like that).

[Read JDM]

The problem with transitioning from childhood to adulthood is the fact that the process isn't based on age but rather on one's own hormones. Be that as it may, we can't have rules and regulations wherein children are treid as adults only if they've gone through puberty (that would open a whole new world of problems), so we pick an age like 18, which, to tell the truth, is an arbitrary and somewhat late age. By the time you're 16, if you kill someone, you damned well know better.

Anyhow, I think the shirking of accountability is, far and away, this society's biggest problem right now, because it's at the root of all our other problems. If you're not comfortable with trying a kid as an adult, then I say we should strongly consider trying parents for their children's crimes. The reason I suggest this is because I believe it will lead more and more parents to take care of their kids like they're supposed to. The only problem I see is that some kids are simply uncontrollable, but, I am someone who was deemed uncontrollable as a kid myself, and I turned out pretty good when I hit my 20s.

In much the same way as parents being accountable for their children, I think lawyers should be held accountable for their clients. There was that one guy out in California whose name I can't remember, but he raped and killed a little girl earlier this year. That guy is a real son of a bitch, but the worst part is, he molested two girls a while back and his lawyer won the court case and the guy walked free. Now, if he had been wrongly accused of molesting those girls, then the lawyer wouldn't have anything to worry about, because the guy wouldn't be tangled in a molestation case again. But, since the guy went and raped and killed a girl this year, I think the lawyer who got him off the first time should be taken to task.

I think this would lead to more honesty in our court system. No one is going to fault a lawyer who knows his client is guilty and who just tries to get the easiest punishment for his client. But on the other hand, a lawyer who knows his client is guilty (like the lawyers for David Westerfield in the Danielle Van Dam case this year) and still sets his client free is, in my opinion, as big a threat to society as his client.

And by the way, this is not to say that every lawyer is bad, or that every parent is bad. There are plenty of outstanding parents (now that I'm old enough, I really can respect the job my own parents did), and there are plenty of upstanding lawyers.

[Steve]

Originally posted by Altair
My point simply is, they're not adults. &nbsp;I'm not defending them, just laughing at our ability to be so illogical and contradictive. &nbsp;I mean, you want to try a 10year old as an adult. &nbsp;Well, maybe it would help if they were an adult, but they're not. &nbsp;Helllllooooooo. &nbsp;Is anybody out there?

Where do you draw the line? &nbsp;You mentioned 16 year olds. &nbsp;Try them as adults since they're only 2 years away from being adults. &nbsp;Doesn't seem to unreasonable. &nbsp;But what about 15 year olds, 10 year olds, 5 year olds, 3 year olds. &nbsp;Where exactly do you draw the line? &nbsp;It seems to me that the logical and best way to draw the line is where the law has drawn the line. &nbsp;People are officially adults at the age of 18. &nbsp;Simple.

Ok, I see your point, but I would argue that if a 10 year old murders someone, unless it was a freak accident, I'd be willing to bet they had the intentions to kill the person before doing it, and thus they should be charged as an adult. A child who picks up a gun and starts playing with it and ends up shooting someone should not be charged as an adult UNLESS they knowingly shot the fun at the person. Age doesn't make a difference in crime (IMO). It's all mental. If the 10 year old had the mental capacity to pick up a shovel and beat a man over the head several times, then he sure as hell better be charged as an adult. An adult realizes the difference between right and wrong, while a child doesn't (usually). The kids even admitted they were focused on beating this man up, they just "didn't realize he would die."

(just using that case as an example because it happened recently).

[Steve]

I am not supporting this stance, but I would bet our society would be much much cleaner and more peaceful if we went back to the laws during the ancient times - An eye for an eye

[Read JDM]

Time served on the Earth doesn't mean you grow in mind.

[TeriB19]

People need to be held accountable for their actions, not teachers, not parents, the actual person committing the crime. It's become so easy to come up with a host of reasons why little Jimmy raped little Ann. ADHD, broken home, emotional turmoil, it's not his fault, it's society's as a whole. I think that's bull. At 12 and 13 years old, 8th and 9th graders are old enough to know that rape, beating and murder are wrong. I agree with Steve that an accidental shooting by no means is grounds for murder one, but beating someone to death, raping a young girl when you are old enough to know better should not mean you get a slap on the wrist and get juvenile det. until you're 18. You do the crime you do the time.

[Altair]

Originally posted by Steve
I am not supporting this stance, but I would bet our society would be much much cleaner and more peaceful if we went back to the laws during the ancient times - An eye for an eye

You know, we're still playing this game of revenge. It's not the ancient way. The death penalty still exists. People still want to get even. We're still in the age of "an eye for an eye." We've tried that for thousands of years now and it's not working. The only thing an eye for an eye gets us is blindness. I say let's try some worldwide compassion. A good dose of that will cure all of this disease.

We all have goodness in us as much as we all have the capacity to be mean. Which of these two do you want to practice? I, myself, choose to practice the good inside. Compassion brother. Let's be good to one another, eh?

[Steve]

Originally posted by Altair
<b>You know, we're still playing this game of revenge. &nbsp;It's not the ancient way. &nbsp;The death penalty still exists. &nbsp;People still want to get even. &nbsp;We're still in the age of "an eye for an eye." &nbsp;We've tried that for thousands of years now and it's not working. &nbsp;The only thing an eye for an eye gets us is blindness. &nbsp;I say let's try some worldwide compassion. &nbsp;A good dose of that will cure all of this disease.

We all have goodness in us as much as we all have the capacity to be mean. &nbsp;Which of these two do you want to practice? &nbsp;I, myself, choose to practice the good inside. &nbsp;Compassion brother. &nbsp;Let's be good to one another, eh? </b>

I disagree with the comment that we are still in an age of "an eye for an eye" If that is the case, why is O.J. wandering the planet still? Honestly though, if someone killed your mother, father, sister, or brother, would you feel compassion for them and say "why don't we give this person another chance in life - let him serve his 5-10 years in prison and walk around society again"

[souldancer]

I am irked with Education drawing the shortest straw -
it's a sad reality that the school system has to feed children, counsel them, TEACH values that they should be receiving from home and their community. Totally agree with you Steve, things have plundered so quickly. But, "all that has been devastated can be recreated." We need to have hope and each make connections to promote positive values. I just attended a workshop with a coalition working to create model charter schools grounded in a foundation of Compassion, Respect and Responsibility - we believe it's the only way to create a generation of caring, responsible adults, parents, leaders that will GIVE TO ONE ANOTHER - the PLANET!

[Altair]

Originally posted by Steve
<b>I disagree with the comment that we are still in an age of "an eye for an eye" If that is the case, why is O.J. wandering the planet still? Honestly though, if someone killed your mother, father, sister, or brother, would you feel compassion for them and say "why don't we give this person another chance in life - let him serve his 5-10 years in prison and walk around society again" </b>

Hard to know since it has never happened. But, in the best of all worlds my gut tells me right now that the "right" thing to do would be to exercise compassion for this person. For someone to commint murder, they must have some horrible issues going on in their life and I feel for that. I don't want anyone to have to feel pain, and it's pain, fear, confusion, anger, and all of those negatives that need to be healed. I've felt a great sense of pain and despair in my life; a hopelessness, a deep-cutting agony and I wouldn't want anyone to go through that, regardless if they had done something wrong. 2 wrongs don't make a right. If we are one, we must seek to heal the wounds, not widen them.
You must understand that I am an idealist. It's just the way I am. I seek what I feel, in my heart of hearts, is ideal and I won't back down. Well, at least I try not to back down. I'm only human.:rolleyes:

[allison]

One thing that really irks me is the trend in our society of not taking personal responsibility for one's actions. People seem to always want to blame someone or something else. Some great examples of this attitude are the frivolous and ridiculous lawsuits tried in this counrty. The one that automatically comes to mind is the woman who got millions from McDonalds b/c she spilled their coffee on her lap and it burned her. And there are many other lawsuits that are just as bad and some that are worse. Completely assinine! Stuff like this really burns me up. :mad:

[TeriB19]

Or the idiot that sued Burger King because he is obese and blamed them for his eating problem. That is so annoying that people don't say "I did this to myself because I had no control over my actions" or "I spilled hot coffee on my lap because I haven't got a single active brain cell in my head" but instead it's always someone else's fault, so they sue.

[JenRN]

Yes Teri and Allison I totally agree with you both. I have seen it so bad at my hospital that people actually have disconnected the foot board off the hospital bed and rigged it so it would fall on their feet and cause harm, then sue the hospital for "default equipment"!!!! Talk about a bunch of crap!!! I choose to carrying a ridiculous about of money in malpractice nursing insurance because people want to blame you for everything that goes wrong!!!!!:mad:

[souldancer]

Yeah, or how people don't take responsisbility for their own health, want the quick fix to have the symptoms relieved by the medical establishment and drug companies that own the country....

This all reminds me of that great Eagles Song...."Get Over
it" - maybe it is a little too angry, but like the movie "Falling Down", it speaks to a society where common sense seems to be an endangered act...Granted, I would like to believe that compassion and respect rule our actions, but there ar times that I humanly get very frustrated too..just like when I get "intolerant of intolerant people" - such an irony. I have a lot of inside-out work yet to do - to be..

<i> if you want to check out lyrics of "Get Over it"...
http://www.davemcnally.com/lyrics/TheEagle...ellFreezesOver/ (http://www.davemcnally.com/lyrics/TheEagles/HellFreezesOver/) </i>

[Dogstar]

Same here, SD. Well said, as usual!

[souldancer]

Originally posted by Read JDM
If you're not comfortable with trying a kid as an adult, then I say we should strongly consider trying parents for their children's crimes. The reason I suggest this is because I believe it will lead more and more parents to take care of their kids like they're supposed to. The only problem I see is that some kids are simply uncontrollable, but, I am someone who was deemed uncontrollable as a kid myself, and I turned out pretty good when I hit my 20s. Sounds pretty punative. I personally don't believe that blame and punishment change people for the better, sure, like a beaten dog they may become submissive or take the other side and become enraged, but I still believe that nurturing young children holistically (physical, emotional, psychologically, spiritually) is preventative. SURE we do have a few violent individuals in a fuXXed-up generation that are not given any rites-of-passages and are constantly condemned by 'adults', poisoned with chemicals, some are void of ethical values, parental and societal narcissim is rampant - but, what about thinking of how to PREVENT THIS CYCLE and move forward - work towards a new generation?!I still have hope in humanity's basic goodness -

[Dogstar]

SD, you are right, we need to stem the tide and work on ending the cycle. But, what do we do with the young ones who are too far gone now? Maybe I'm a bit of a pessimist, but I'm not sure young people who have gone so far as to commit such horrific acts can be turned around without taking them out of society for a while. I don't know, maybe I'm being too negative...

[souldancer]

I wish I had an answer. I think I am still operating on a Creed High from the recent concerts.

This might sound cold, but maybe we have to risk losing part of a couple generations to prepare for the future. However, in the mean time we can LEARN, then apply our knowledge and rouse our energy and faith to make positive changes! We both love WGMB - such a powerful song!

Wait - here is a thought, we can have mandatory Creed concerts for all sixth and ninth grade students across the nation; supplemented with Creed music twice daily in the classroom. THAT iS BOUND TO HAVE A POSITIVE IMPACT on both students AND teachers!!!! ;)

<i> Life can only be understood backwards; but it must be lived forwards." Kierkegaard </i>

[Dogstar]

Wait - here is a thought, we can have mandatory Creed concerts for all sixth and ninth grade students across the nation; supplemented with Creed music twice daily in the classroom. THAT iS BOUND TO HAVE A POSITIVE IMPACT on both students AND teachers!!!!

LOL, can't argue with that!

[TeriB19]

Wish they had that in my school growing up instead of those farkin BeeGees.:P

[souldancer]

Staying Alive, Staying Alive,....whoa whoa whoa whoa....
:dancing:

[Siana]

The issue that irks me is economics and to be more specific Marksism...I had a fight last week with a guy who was soooooo dumb..I tried to explain him thing but....

[allison]

Hmmm, which reminds me...ignorance really irks me.

[TeriB19]

Originally posted by allison
Hmmm, which reminds me...ignorance really irks me. Ignorant people suck.

[Siana]

Originally posted by allison
Hmmm, which reminds me...ignorance really irks me.

yes,that's right..

[souldancer]

I think I can deal with ignorance, if it just means "not knowing' - we are all ignorant about different issues. Some people do care about learning and growing, but yeah - it's sad, those who have their narrow minds 'made up', or are just to lazy to care.

[Siana]

it's worse to talk about things you haven't heard of or you don't have enough information..and most of the ppl do that...

[Dogstar]

Boy, ain't that the truth, Siana...Creed bashers come to mind. People criticizing when they are ill-informed....grrrrr.....Hey, by the way, glad to see you back. Seems as if you were away for a bit. Hope all is well.:)

[Siana]

yes,it's just like that :) I'm ok I guess,but today all my ID's were stolen :( I don't even know how it all happened,I didn't feel anything...

[TeriB19]

Oh my hell, Siana, that's terrible! I'm very sorry to hear that. I had a credit card stolen about 12 years ago and I know it's such a violation! It's a horrible feeling. The ignorant thief that took my Discover card charged up over $1800 worth of charges (luckily I was young and only had an $1800 credit limit!) The credit card company was extremely helpful and I was not responsible for any of the fraudulent charges. I hope you have luck in getting things straightened out.

[allison]

Originally posted by souldancer
<b>I think I can deal with ignorance, if it just means "not knowing' - we are all ignorant &nbsp;about different issues. &nbsp;Some people do care about learning and growing, but yeah - it's sad, those who have their narrow minds 'made up', or are just to lazy to care. </b>

Exactly. That's the kind I mean.

[allison]

Originally posted by Siana
yes,it's just like that :) I'm ok I guess,but today all my ID's were stolen :( I don't even know how it all happened,I didn't feel anything...

That's awful Siana! You mean you were pick-pocketed by someone?

[JenRN]

Sorry to hear that Siana, it really sucks to have your credit card stolen!!! Been there done that:mad:

[Read JDM]

Originally posted by souldancer
I still have hope in humanity's basic goodness

I never had such hope. If I did, I'd imagine it would've evaporated by now. I've encountered far too many assholes, and I've seen groupthink transform far too many nice people into total jerks (both permanent and momentary), to make such a sweeping statement as humans are good. But hey, I can't say I don't admire you for seeing it that way. I wish I did. :)

[Siana]

Originally posted by allison
That's awful Siana! &nbsp;You mean you were pick-pocketed by someone?

yeah,that's right..and guess what!This morning I found my wallet in my mailbox!!!!!!!!!!!:wow: All my ID's and docs were there,all pics too,except my $ of course....That I call thieves with honour...

[allison]

That's great! Are you sure you didn't just drop your wallet then and some nice person gave it back to you? Why would a thief give you your wallet pack with nothing missing unless he had a weird attack of conscience or something. Bizarre! :eye:

[TeriB19]

Siana, I'm so glad to hear you got your stuff back. Too bad about the cash, but the id and credit cards are the important things.

[JenRN]

Siana... you should call the credit card companies and ask for a current report, due to possible unathourized activity!!! Hate to be that way but..... never can be too safe!

[allison]

Originally posted by allison
That's great! Are you sure you didn't just drop your wallet then and some nice person gave it back to you? &nbsp;Why would a thief give you your wallet pack with nothing missing unless he had a weird attack of conscience or something. &nbsp;Bizarre! :eye:

Oh, my bad, I didn't read closely enough to see that your cash was stolen. Sure hope it wasn't alot. :(

[Siana]

don't worry,i didn't have much $ with me that day!

[Siana]

Originally posted by allison
That's great! Are you sure you didn't just drop your wallet then and some nice person gave it back to you? &nbsp;Why would a thief give you your wallet pack with nothing missing unless he had a weird attack of conscience or something. &nbsp;Bizarre! :eye:

yes,I'm 100% sure I didn't drop it!
Maybe somebody found the wallet somewhere,saw the address on my ID and just gave it back to me..that some1 maybe is not the thief,but anyways,I'm glad everything is ok now:)

[Siana]

Originally posted by JenRN
Siana... you should call the credit card companies and ask for a current report, due to possible unathourized activity!!! &nbsp;Hate to be that way but..... never can be too safe!

everything was done!;)