Al Qaeda in Iraq to Pope Benedict XVI: 'You and the West Are Doomed'

[Chase]

It's nice to see that the Islamic world is proving the Pope right...

CAIRO, Egypt — Al Qaeda in Iraq warned Pope Benedict XVI on Monday that its war against Christianity and the West will go on until Islam takes over the world, and Iran's supreme leader called for more protests over the pontiff's remarks on Islam.

Protests broke out in South Asia and Indonesia, with angry Muslims saying Benedict's statement of regret a day earlier did not go far enough. In southern Iraq, demonstrators carrying black flags burned an effigy of the pope.

Islamic leaders around the world issued more condemnations of the pope's comments, but some moderates in the Middle East appeared to be trying to put a damper on the outrage, fearing it could spiral into attacks on Christians in the region.

On Sunday, Benedict said he was "deeply sorry" over any hurt caused by his comments made in a speech last week, in which he quoted a medieval text characterizing some of the Prophet Muhammad's teachings as "evil and inhuman" and calling Islam a religion spread by the sword.

Benedict said the remarks came from a text that didn't reflect his own opinion, but he did not retract what he said or say he was sorry he uttered what proved to be explosive words.

The Vatican on Monday sought to defuse the anger, ordering papal representatives around the world to meet with leaders of Muslim countries to explain the pope's point of view and full context of his speech.

Roman Catholic leaders stepped forward to defend the pontiff. At an Italian bishops' conference, Cardinal Camillo Ruini underlined the bishops' "total closeness and solidarity to the pope" and said they deplored interpretations of the pope's comments "which attribute to the Holy Father ... errors that he has not committed and aim at attacking his person and his ministry."

Few in the Islamic world were satisfied by Benedict's statement of regret.

"The pope's words have caused a deep wound in the hearts of Muslims that won't heal for a long time, and then only after a clear apology to Muslims," Egypt's religious affairs minister, Mahmoud Hamdi Zaqzouq, wrote in a column in the government daily Al-Ahram on Monday.

An influential Egyptian cleric, Sheik Youssef al-Qaradawi, called for protests after weekly prayers on Friday, but maintained they should be peaceful.

Extremists said the pope's comments proved that the West was in a war against Islam.

Al Qaeda in Iraq and its allies issued a statement addressing the pope as "a cross-worshipper" and warning, "You and the West are doomed, as you can see from the defeat in Iraq, Afghanistan, Chechnya and elsewhere.

"You infidels and despots, we will continue our jihad (holy war) and never stop until God avails us to chop your necks and raise the fluttering banner of monotheism, when God's rule is established governing all people and nations," said the statement by the Mujahedeen Shura Council, an umbrella organization of Sunni Arab extremist groups in Iraq.

Another Iraqi extremist group, Ansar al-Sunna, challenged "sleeping Muslims" to prove their manhood by doing something other than "issuing statements or holding demonstrations."

"If the stupid pig is prancing with his blasphemies in his house," the group said in a Web statement, referring to the pope, "then let him wait for the day coming soon when the armies of the religion of right knock on the walls of Rome."

In Iran, supreme leader Ayatollah Ali Khamenei used the comments to call for protests against the United States. He argued that while the pope may have been deceived into making his remarks, the words give the West an "excuse for suppressing Muslims" by depicting them as terrorists.

"Those who benefit from the pope's comments and drive their own arrogant policies should be targeted with attacks and protests," he said, referring to the United States.

The anger recalled the outrage earlier this year over cartoons depicting the prophet published by a Danish paper. The caricatures, which Muslims saw as insulting Muhammad, set off large, violent protests across the Islamic world.

So far, protests over the pope's comments have been smaller. However, there has been some violence: Attackers hurled firebombs at seven churches in the West Bank and Gaza Strip over the weekend, and a nun was shot to death in Somalia.

Some 200 Khamenei loyalists in the Syrian capital, Damascus, held a protest Monday at an Islamic shrine, dismissing the pope's apology. "The pope's sorrow was equivocal," read one banner.

Dozens protested outside the Vatican Embassy in Jakarta, Indonesia, and schools and shops in the Indian-controlled section of Kashmir shut their doors in protest.

"His comments really hurt Muslims all over the world," Umar Nawawi of the radical Islamic Defenders' Front said in Jakarta. "We should remind him not to say such things which can only fuel a holy war."

Islamic countries also asked the U.N. Human Rights Council to examine the question of religious tolerance. Malaysia's foreign minister, Syed Hamid Albar, said Benedict's apology was "inadequate to calm the anger."

In Egypt, the Muslim Brotherhood said the anger should not be allowed to hurt ties with the Middle East's Christian minorities. But worries among Christians in the region are high.

Guards have been posted around some churches, and the head of Egypt's Orthodox Coptic Church, Pope Shenouda III, disassociated himself from Benedict's statements.

The Dominican mission in Cairo also criticized Benedict's words, saying he chose a text for his speech that "revived the polemics of the past."

"These comments, seen by many Muslims as hurtful, risk encouraging extremists on all sides," it said in a statement, "and put in danger all the advances in dialogue made in recent decades."

[Ana4Stapp]

No....the Pope wasnt right!!!!! You cant keep repeating that all muslims are people who defends the use of violent methods to impose their faith!!! You cant agree with that! I know waht Im saying....I have special friends who are muslims and i CAN TELL YOU THAT THEY ARE VERY GOOD PEOPLE ..PEOPLE LIKE ME AND YOU ....WITH VALUES LIKE MORAL, RESPECT, ETHICS ,GOODNESS ...people who have family and frinds and that could never hurt other people just because they are from other faith....

[eusebioCBR]

There are good people in all walks of life. In this case unfortunately I have once again been told I (west/Christian) am "doomed". I'm not worried about the good people. I'm concerned about anybody that wishes me harm.

[metalchris25]

I dont think that he meat all muslims were violent. Anyone with a second grade education knows that they are not, most are just like the rest of us.

[RalphyS]

But this is exactly why 'these good people', let's call them 'moderate muslims' (to avoid the hated word 'liberal') need to speak out agains the atrocities of their religion, and also against these massive protests once again about 'words', which weren't even meant in this manor, but we only hear the 'extremists' and this frankly scares me.

In Christianity luckily the fundamentalists have become a minority since the enlightenement, I am now waiting for islam to be enlightened from within!!!

[Chase]

This is exactly what I'm talking about. Yeah... sure, the Pope wasn't completely accurate in his statements. But where are the voices of the moderate Muslims? They just told the world how offended they were, then they don't say a thing when these extremists say that they want to chop off heads and conquer the world?!

Ralphy put it best... Islam is in serious need for an enlightenment and/or reformation. I believe that most Muslims in the Western world have already abandoned violent interpretations of Islam. Christians went through their period of extremism centuries ago... but were able to, as a whole, become a far more peaceful religion.

However, what's going on in Middle East right absolutely startles me. Watching Islamic extremists manipulate the sensitivities of the average Muslim is disturbing. They're slowly destroying that religion from the inside. They're the only group that views this a religious conflict, while the West sees this as a war of ideologies. Major difference.

This is getting ridiculous, it really is. In these protests, you see the same sort of immaturity... over and over again. You saw it with the cartoon fiasco, and now we see it again. They're burning German flags because apparently they don't see a difference between church and state. It's like they see Germany as fueling the Pope. They burned Danish flags a while back. Okay, I'm in Sweden right now... and I can tell you that Scandinavians are the last people looking for trouble. In Iran, you have a president who is constantly offending Europe (and, of course, the United States). Europe and America are different in terms of foreign policy, that's obvious. Yet, I don't know how much longer Europe is willing to deal patiently with Islamic extremism. Islamic extremists are making a big mistake by dragging Europeans into this.

This is equally disturbing:
Sister Leonella, 65, a nun who devoted her life to helping ill people in Africa, used to joke there was a bullet with her name engraved on it in Somalia. When the bullet came, she used her last breaths to forgive those responsible.



"I forgive, I forgive," she whispered in her native Italian just before she died Sunday in Mogadishu, the Somali capital, the Rev. Maloba Wesonga told the Associated Press at the nun's memorial mass Monday in Nairobi, Kenya.



The attack by two gunmen was not random and could have been a result of the Muslim anger over remarks by Pope Benedict XVI linking Islam and violence, said Willy Huber, regional head of the Austrian-financed hospital where the Roman Catholic nun worked.



But Abdurahman Mohamed Farah, deputy leader of the Islamic militia, disputed that, blaming it instead on Somali warlords who were driven out of Mogadishu in June.



Sister Leonella, whose birth name was Rosa Sgorbati, had lived and worked in Kenya and Somalia for 38 years. Her bodyguard also was slain.




Associated Press

[eusebioCBR]

But this is exactly why 'these good people', let's call them 'moderate muslims' (to avoid the hated word 'liberal') need to speak out agains the atrocities of their religion, and also against these massive protests once again about 'words', which weren't even meant in this manor, but we only hear the 'extremists' and this frankly scares me.

In Christianity luckily the fundamentalists have become a minority since the enlightenement, I am now waiting for islam to be enlightened from within!!!

I COMPLETELY agree with you.

[Ana4Stapp]

This is exactly what I'm talking about. Yeah... sure, the Pope wasn't completely accurate in his statements. But where are the voices of the moderate Muslims? They just told the world how offended they were, then they don't say a thing when these extremists say that they want to chop off heads and conquer the world?!
]

I can agree with your points but Chase, is media interested in show their voices? Are the newspapers willing to publish their opinions as the same way the TV channels shows the protests of radical ones on the streets? Will this reach the same audience? Will this sells the same quantity of papers? Since everything is guided by the convenience of the media these days my friend, I'm not sure if we are going to have the chance to hear their voices...

[Ana4Stapp]

Yeah... sure, the Pope wasn't completely accurate in his statements.
]

But he needs to be...otherwise dont make a statement like that.Thats the point.They werent Ana's or Eusebio's or Ralphy's opinions...they were Pope 's words...

[bilal]

i wish i would some day see a topic that actually tells how muslims in general feels like...... i did'nt hear this bullshit that is posted here but only that media has coveyed it to the world over, i wish they do the same for what most of Muslims even in Iraq or Iran or other ARab countries feel like,.... its only you guys by discussing these topics are spreading the wrong words, or maybe that you only get this kind foul messages only, or media people knows what is hot and what is gona sell and media blocks out my voice or other muslims voices , cause to be very honest...no one gives a damn about it in western countires....they just give a damn about what affects their SECURITY, so its an irony that only these ill messages get through to you...... i dont even understand what this topic was posted here for.....

[Chase]

i wish i would some day see a topic that actually tells how muslims in general feels like...... i did'nt hear this bullshit that is posted here but only that media has coveyed it to the world over, i wish they do the same for what most of Muslims even in Iraq or Iran or other ARab countries feel like,.... its only you guys by discussing these topics are spreading the wrong words, or maybe that you only get this kind foul messages only, or media people knows what is hot and what is gona sell and media blocks out my voice or other muslims voices , cause to be very honest...no one gives a damn about it in western countires....they just give a damn about what affects their SECURITY, so its an irony that only these ill messages get through to you...... i dont even understand what this topic was posted here for.....

Wait a minute. It's not wrong to start a topic on the Pope's comments, but it's wrong to post this? There aren't any other stories because Muslims aren't publicly denouncing this behavior. Yet, until then... we're going to post the major stories of the day. You're upset about the Pope's words... but you're upset when Al Qaeda threatens to behead the Pope and every other non-Muslim? This is a BIG deal. It's important because Muslims can either allow these extremists to speak for them, or they can take back their religion. It's their choice.

[bilal]

^ your compareing POPE with AlQaeda.....,POPE, which for many represents the Whole Christian community with Al-Qaeda, which represents no one....... what an excellent argument ..... may be you must clear up your confusions in thou head ............. in the first line of this thread, you associated this bullshit message with saying that its from the Islamic world....... where as every muslim contry has issued official statments, all you can come up with is some bullshit message from this fictitious AlQaeda and you label it as response from Muslim World,really?.....your sure?....... even in the whole text of the article you quoted, you highlight what appeals and attracts you the most, the same bullshit from this bullshit AlQaeda.....and there you just confirmed the problem i spoke about in my previous post........ may you should act a bit more responsible....

[Chase]

^ your compareing POPE with AlQaeda.....,POPE, which for many represents the Whole Christian community with Al-Qaeda, which represents no one....... what an excellent argument ..... may be you must clear up your confusions in thou head ............. in the first line of this thread, you associated this bullshit message with saying that its from the Islamic world....... where as every muslim contry has issued official statments, all you can come up with is some bullshit message from this fictitious AlQaeda and you label it as response from Muslim World,really?.....your sure?....... even in the whole text of the article you quoted, you highlight what appeals and attracts you the most, the same bullshit from this bullshit AlQaeda.....and there you just confirmed the problem i spoke about in my previous post........ may you should act a bit more responsible....

I'm not comparing. I'm following up on the previous thread. This is the response that is coming from people who claim to represent to Islamic world. For the record, "fictitious" group aren't responsible for thousands of deaths around the world.

Why are you so bent out of shape? Why are upset that I posted a very relevent story? You're all pissed that I posted this and saying that this garbage doesn't represent Muslims. I know it doesn't. But the reason why I'm upset is because your peers don't seem to make an effort to refute the statements of the extremists. That's my problem. So, instead of telling me to act more responsible... try saving that for the people who are burning effagies of the Pope and condemning the West... while they're somehow trying to convince the world that violence towards non-Muslims isn't preached.

[Lunar Shadow]

YAY! We are all doomed bust out the bubbley and celebrate the end YAY!

[bilal]

For the record, "fictitious" group aren't responsible for thousands of deaths around the world.

hey, i may sound really out-of-context here, but i am not sure if AlQaeda realy ever gets to kill thousands of people, as you claimed, and if thats really the case, isnt it interesting that millions of people fear a group of shitbags who kill just less than 1% of what many Governments, like that of USA or Israel kill in the name of Democracy and peace.... so when we say AlQaeda, that to me represents a truely FICTITIOUS group that is used to lure people of many many nations to stay quite and not to protest...... sound almost ironical to me.....it seems you are under the same therapy ........ think about it......


Why are you so bent out of shape? Why are upset that I posted a very relevent story? You're all pissed that I posted this and saying that this garbage doesn't represent Muslims. I know it doesn't. But the reason why I'm upset is because your peers don't seem to make an effort to refute the statements of the extremists. That's my problem.

as i said before, if some Muslim Clerik, or Government of Islamic country fall below the depths of humanity, and started blamming JESUS CHRIST or HOLY DAVID for all the sins of Christians or non mulims, how would the world react to that.......... think about it......



So, instead of telling me to act more responsible... try saving that for the people who are burning effagies of the Pope and condemning the West... while they're somehow trying to convince the world that violence towards non-Muslims isn't preached.


i wont stop people who are burning the effagies of Pope, those who do it are mostly poor people of nations, in which democracy isnt that well rooted , and voices of people arnt that well heard, or not even heard at all.....so the end up doing these little acts to show their protest.....its a REACTION caused by an ACTION, if you slap me in the face and if i react in slapin my own self back, that wont be appropirate would it be...... think about it

[Chase]

Terrorist Acts Suspected of or Inspired by al-Qaeda
1993 (Feb.): Bombing of World Trade Center (WTC); 6 killed.
1993 (Oct.): Killing of U.S. soldiers in Somalia.
1996 (June): Truck bombing at Khobar Towers barracks in Dhahran, Saudi Arabia, killed 19 Americans.
1998 (Aug.): Bombing of U.S. embassies in Kenya and Tanzania; 224 killed, including 12 Americans.
1999 (Dec.): Plot to bomb millennium celebrations in Seattle foiled when customs agents arrest an Algerian smuggling explosives into the U.S.
2000 (Oct.): Bombing of the USS Cole in port in Yemen; 17 U.S. sailors killed.
2001 (Sept.): Destruction of WTC; attack on Pentagon. Total dead 2,992.
2001 (Dec.): Man tried to denote shoe bomb on flight from Paris to Miami.
2002 (April): Explosion at historic synagogue in Tunisia left 21 dead, including 11 German tourists.
2002 (May): Car exploded outside hotel in Karachi, Pakistan, killing 14, including 11 French citizens.
2002 (June): Bomb exploded outside American consulate in Karachi, Pakistan, killing 12.
2002 (Oct.): Boat crashed into oil tanker off Yemen coast, killing 1.
2002 (Oct.): Nightclub bombings in Bali, Indonesia, killed 202, mostly Australian citizens.
2002 (Nov.): Suicide attack on a hotel in Mombasa, Kenya, killed 16.
2003 (May): Suicide bombers killed 34, including 8 Americans, at housing compounds for Westerners in Riyadh, Saudi Arabia.
2003 (May): 4 bombs killed 33 people targeting Jewish, Spanish, and Belgian sites in Casablanca, Morocco.
2003 (Aug.): Suicide car-bomb killed 12, injured 150 at Marriott Hotel in Jakarta, Indonesia.
2003 (Nov.): Explosions rocked a Riyadh, Saudi Arabia, housing compound, killing 17.
2003 (Nov.): Suicide car-bombers simultaneously attacked 2 synagogues in Istanbul, Turkey, killing 25 and injuring hundreds.
2003 (Nov.): Truck bombs detonated at London bank and British consulate in Istanbul, Turkey, killing 26.
2004 (March): 10 bombs on 4 trains exploded almost simultaneously during the morning rush hour in Madrid, Spain, killing 191 and injuring more than 1,500.
2004 (May): Terrorists attacked Saudi oil company offices in Khobar, Saudi Arabia, killing 22.
2004 (June): Terrorists kidnapped and executed American Paul Johnson, Jr., in Riyadh, Saudi Arabia.
2004 (Sept.): Car bomb outside the Australian embassy in Jakarta, Indonesia, killed 9.
2004 (Dec.): Terrorists entered the U.S. Consulate in Jeddah, Saudi Arabia, killing 9 (including 4 attackers).
2005 (July): Bombs exploded on 3 trains and a bus in London, England, killing 52.
2005 (Oct.): 22 killed by 3 suicide bombs in Bali, Indonesia.
2005 (Nov.): 57 killed at 3 American hotels in Amman, Jordan.
2006 (Aug.): More than 25 arrested in plot to blow up jetliners between London and U.S.

That's "fictitious" to you?

[bilal]

^ hey man, thanks for the data....i respect that

although, most of the early events mentioned are pre-AlQaeda, but let just assume that all are done by same motive holders........... the reason i called AlQaeda Fictitious was of the fact that the way AlQaeda name is used by many Governments as a mean to shut up the voice of theri liberal people against the war........ you can see from the data that you have provided, that its not even 1% of what those Governments have done in using AlQaeda as reason ............ and if i may reproduce your own words, you said that AlQaeda kill thousands of people around the world, you can see that in totallity and in most streachable association of events, you can see that in totallity , kilings associated with AlQaeda are far less then even 1% of what Governments do by holding AlQaeda as reason........ that use is surely Fictitious, i am sure by studying your own data, you will also conclude that Governments need to have more sound reason than just Alqaeda before it launches any of its adventurism in a muslim civillian area, killing thousands there, just in hope to prevent any remotely expected attack by the almost fictitious AlQaeda.......


on a side note, Chase i respect your opinion here, your right, you can see form the list you have provided that has also enhanced my information, you can see that most of the attacks are in muslim countires where majority killed are muslims and workers in and around US embassies, although you and i will surely disagree as for the purpose of those attacks, i will say that its not becuase of fanatisism but of revolt and anger for misdoings of US expressed in an evil and ill way, you will say that its targettted against pride and supremesy of AMerican nation, we will surely disagree upon that, but i respect your hatred for such groups, but i just hope that USA stop providing these groups more and more followers and more and more popularity and start acting in unison with muslim views and not against em, Friendship should be the goal of US activities and not just doing some rought war on muslim grounds leaving thousands of injured souls as prospective terrrorists.....

[SecretWeapon]

^ your compareing POPE with AlQaeda.....,POPE, which for many represents the Whole Christian community with Al-Qaeda, which represents no one....... what an excellent argument ..... may be you must clear up your confusions in thou head ............. in the first line of this thread, you associated this bullshit message with saying that its from the Islamic world....... where as every muslim contry has issued official statments, all you can come up with is some bullshit message from this fictitious AlQaeda and you label it as response from Muslim World,really?.....your sure?....... even in the whole text of the article you quoted, you highlight what appeals and attracts you the most, the same bullshit from this bullshit AlQaeda.....and there you just confirmed the problem i spoke about in my previous post........ may you should act a bit more responsible....

The Pope does not represent all Christians. Not even close. He only represents the Catholics, and not even all Catholics at that.

although, most of the early events mentioned are pre-AlQaeda, but let just assume that all are done by same motive holders........... the reason i called AlQaeda Fictitious was of the fact that the way AlQaeda name is used by many Governments as a mean to shut up the voice of theri liberal people against the war........ you can see from the data that you have provided, that its not even 1% of what those Governments have done in using AlQaeda as reason ............ and if i may reproduce your own words, you said that AlQaeda kill thousands of people around the world, you can see that in totallity and in most streachable association of events, you can see that in totallity , kilings associated with AlQaeda are far less then even 1% of what Governments do by holding AlQaeda as reason........ that use is surely Fictitious, i am sure by studying your own data, you will also conclude that Governments need to have more sound reason than just Alqaeda before it launches any of its adventurism in a muslim civillian area, killing thousands there, just in hope to prevent any remotely expected attack by the almost fictitious AlQaeda.......

The problem is that the United Nations desire world peace, and Al
qaeda apearantly loves to slaughter innocents. So we've got an issue.
And just for the record, USA doesn't hate Islam. Was was it Bush
called Islam? A Noble Religion, I think.

I and understand that Muslims are offended by the way they're
represented as violent war-mongerers, but there's also a whole
other side that the Christians are on, that nobody hears about,
either. When you hear "Pope" you think "Christianity" and that's
not very accurate, either.

The main problem with all of this is that almost NO ONE in here
seems to want to open up their minds very wide and consider
all sides.

[bilal]

The Pope does not represent all Christians. Not even close. He only represents the Catholics, and not even all Catholics at that.



The problem is that the United Nations desire world peace, and Al
qaeda apearantly loves to slaughter innocents. So we've got an issue.
And just for the record, USA doesn't hate Islam. Was was it Bush
called Islam? A Noble Religion, I think.

I and understand that Muslims are offended by the way they're
represented as violent war-mongerers, but there's also a whole
other side that the Christians are on, that nobody hears about,
either. When you hear "Pope" you think "Christianity" and that's
not very accurate, either.

The main problem with all of this is that almost NO ONE in here
seems to want to open up their minds very wide and consider
all sides.


i am willing to take Secret WEapons comment as an independent and un-biased conclusion to the discussion in this topic...i have no serious objections.......