billboard chart?

[sina2b]

Im not sure how the billboard chart works and how frequently and when it gets updated, but shouldnt TGD be on this weeks chart, not a top position but it should have a spot somewhere amongst the top 100! I went to the billboard site but didnt see it anywhere on the charts.

[Unforgiven Fan]

well I think that comes out tuesday or wedensday...if I remember there chart releases schedule...

[titan9]

It's too early for it to be up. I've heard they put a new one up every Wednesday or Thursday, so look for it then.

[facelessmike]

TGD First week sales as posted at pbf:

#19 with 91,158 Sales

A little slower than I expected with all the promotion, but I still think TGD will do well. Before you ask AB moved 95,000 first week...

[titan9]

Hitsdailydouble.com, which reported those sales, is a tiny bit off typically. The official sales, by Billboard, should be out tomorrow. I think it should be a little bit higher than that, but I could be wrong.

[SummerGirl]

TGD First week sales as posted at pbf:

#19 with 91,158 Sales

A little slower than I expected with all the promotion, but I still think TGD will do well. Before you ask AB moved 95,000 first week...

Thank you Faceless! That was very thoughtful...and it means that you are writing for your audience... :cool:

I'm pleased with these numbers. Both groups will continue to enjoy their own success as it should be.

[uncertaindrumer]

First off, didn't AB sell 135 the first week? I must be totally wrong but I coulda sworn that's what VH1 said... not that they are super reliable...

And second... Vindication. Sorry Titan. lol

[sina2b]

First off, didn't AB sell 135 the first week? I must be totally wrong but I coulda sworn that's what VH1 said... not that they are super reliable...

And second... Vindication. Sorry Titan. lol


with all the promotions i thought it'll do at least a few hundred thousand, opening at number 19 is not really good in my oponion.

[titan9]

First off, didn't AB sell 135 the first week? I must be totally wrong but I coulda sworn that's what VH1 said... not that they are super reliable...

And second... Vindication. Sorry Titan. lol

I thought so as well, but it turns out that AB's official number was 95,000, according to Billboard. I think Billboard's is the most accurate, so that's why I'm waiting until I see their numbers for this week before I say much more on Stapp's sales.

[Bridge of Clay]

95,000 rounded? weird...

[titan9]

Yeah, I could have sworn it was 105,000, but I guess I had my numbers wrong. Anyway, MTV reports that the TGD sold 94,000 copies and debuted at #18(not #19). When you consider the fact that, to be in the top 5, it took over 200,000 in record sales, that's pretty good. Keep in mind that when ODR debuted, it only took 95,000 to debut in the top 5. The competition(bands like S.O.A.D., and artists like Madonna) was obviously tougher for TGD. Add in the fact that (1) the single hasn't gotten much airplay (2) it's been nearly 18 months since the official split (3) most people have probably forgotten about Creed, and it becomes apparent the reason why these numbers were less than a lot of people expected. I think timing played a huge role in these sales. Had TGD been released last November, I have a feeling that the sales would have been higher because that would have capitalized more on Creed's popularity. Of course, the lower than expected sales could be because there are a lot of anti-Stapp, anti-Creed people out there, but I'd bet on the former. Just a bit of food for the thought.

[Bridge of Clay]

still... among the Creed fan base, he didn't sell as much.

[titan9]

You're right. But AB didn't sell that much among the Creed fan base, either. I'm going based off of sales, not rankings. Both sold roughly 90,000-95,000. They're really both on an equal level: Stapp is trying to establish himself as a solo artist, and AB is trying to establish themselves as a new band, not Creed v2. Neither is as big as Creed was, and may never achieve that type of success again.

[SummerGirl]

I think timing played a huge role in these sales. Had TGD been released last November, I have a feeling that the sales would have been higher because that would have capitalized more on Creed's popularity. Of course, the lower than expected sales could be because there are a lot of anti-Stapp, anti-Creed people out there, but I'd bet on the former. Just a bit of food for the thought.

I'm borrowing from a discussion at lunch today, but AB released during back to school time....08/10/04, while Stapp had the additional benefit of being released during the busiest shopping week of the year.

[titan9]

Yes and that's a very good point, but my point was that the break-up was still fresh back in August of last year. Creed was still rather fresh as well. Fast forward 18 months, and a lot of people have probably forgotten about Creed(they've essentially been replaced on Pop radio by the likes of Nickelback and 3 Doors Down) and the break-up. My point was that AB had the benefit of the break-up announcement and the publicity, while Stapp, because he waited so long to put this album out, did not.

[SummerGirl]

Yes and that's a very good point, but my point was that the break-up was still fresh back in August of last year. Creed was still rather fresh as well. Fast forward 18 months, and a lot of people have probably forgotten about Creed(they've essentially been replaced on Pop radio by the likes of Nickelback and 3 Doors Down) and the break-up. My point was that AB had the benefit of the break-up announcement and the publicity, while Stapp, because he waited so long to put this album out, did not.

I was simply adding to the food for thought idea.

My friend has suggested for over a year now that Creed was on its death rattle...the high schoolers are in college now...the soccer moms have moved on too...and the rockers are still there supporting either side or both. I agree with you on that point.

As far as the break up of Creed...again, it didn't rattle too many cages. I have repeatedly talked to people in lines or surrounding the concert venue or at an Alter Bridge concert (or, in everyday life) and the majority did not know that AB was even part of Creed. Many still don't know that Creed broke up!

AB did not claim the former Creed stuff...Wind-up tried, but Mark didn't embrace it...the media would constantly mention it during interviews etc.

Throwing back to the original idea here, the ties to Creed was probably harmful to AB if anything.

[Mrprophetman]

TGD First week sales as posted at pbf:

#19 with 91,158 Sales

A little slower than I expected with all the promotion, but I still think TGD will do well. Before you ask AB moved 95,000 first week...

Actually it was 94,998, but then I'm a stickler for details. Also consider that it was released in August, not the busiest shopping month of the year...especially for music.

[titan9]

I was simply adding to the food for thought idea.

My friend has suggested for over a year now that Creed was on its death rattle...the high schoolers are in college now...the soccer moms have moved on too...and the rockers are still there supporting either side or both. I agree with you on that point.

As far as the break up of Creed...again, it didn't rattle too many cages. I have repeatedly talked to people in lines or surrounding the concert venue or at an Alter Bridge concert (or, in everyday life) and the majority did not know that AB was even part of Creed. Many still don't know that Creed broke up!

AB did not claim the former Creed stuff...Wind-up tried, but Mark didn't embrace it...the media would constantly mention it during interviews etc.

Throwing back to the original idea here, the ties to Creed was probably harmful to AB if anything.

Gotcha, then. It's true, WU did try to really use the Creed name to promote AB. I don't think that hurt them, though. I mean, it might have hurt them in the sense that some radio stations will avoid playing them because 3/4 of AB was in Creed, but I don't think it hurt their sales. If anything, I think it helped(the sales) because Creed was popular in the general music public's(not critics) eyes. Otherwise, Creed would have not sold 30+ million albums.

AB definitely didn't embrace the "former Creed members" stuff. That was evident from the interviews they did.

You're dead on about a lot of people not knowing that Creed broke up. It didn't get the publicity that it deserved.

I'd just like to add that it's nice to see new members around here who make good points and do so in a respectful manner, without attacking anyone. :)

[SummerGirl]

Titan9...thank you for the welcome. I like this board and enjoy reading the "discussions."

We are all here for the same reason the love of music.

[facelessmike]

[QUOTE=SummerGirl]I was simply adding to the food for thought idea.

My friend has suggested for over a year now that Creed was on its death rattle...the high schoolers are in college now...the soccer moms have moved on too...and the rockers are still there supporting either side or both. I agree with you on that point.

As far as the break up of Creed...again, it didn't rattle too many cages. I have repeatedly talked to people in lines or surrounding the concert venue or at an Alter Bridge concert (or, in everyday life) and the majority did not know that AB was even part of Creed. Many still don't know that Creed broke up!
QUOTE]

A good assessment! It seems that other than the 100k or so die hards that continue to really support them, the overwhelming majority of Creed fans were of the casual variety that may have moved on. Who knows if either AB or Stapp will ever even go platinum again?...I certainly hope so.

[titan9]

Titan9...thank you for the welcome. I like this board and enjoy reading the "discussions."

We are all here for the same reason the love of music.

Exactly. This has got to be the best Creed/Alter Bridge/Stapp board on the internet. It is superbly moderated and the vast majority of the people on here are polite and friendly. I've been to other Creed/AB/Stapp boards, and have never felt comfortable at those boards. But here, I feel comfortable enough to post on a daily basis. That says a lot, considering there are really only three boards I post at on a daily basis: this one and a couple of fan site boards that I Admin(see my sig).

Lately, there have been some new members who haven't acted politely, such as the two or three that were banned a few weeks ago for flaming members of the board. So it's a breath of fresh air when a new member comes along and discusses things intelligently and respectfully. You're one of those new members and so is IAmFilthy. I enjoy reading posts by both of you, because you both pretty much always have good points, even though I might occasionally disagree. :D

A good assessment! It seems that other than the 100k or so die hards that continue to really support them, the overwhelming majority of Creed fans were of the casual variety that may have moved on. Who knows if either AB or Stapp will ever even go platinum again?...I certainly hope so.

I agree. I'd venture to say that the vast majority of those who bought Creed albums don't care for the band or its members anymore. I think both AB and Stapp could eventually go platinum, but only if they get enough promotion and radio play. It should be interesting to see how the other singles from TGD fare, as well as the singles from AB's new CD, when that one comes out.

[uncertaindrumer]

Wait, hold on, Titan9 is agreeing with my long held opinion that Creed has is and will be forgotten? wow... lol

[titan9]

Most, if not all, of the stuff that is currently popular will be forgotten in 5, 10, 20 years. Only the legendary artists/bands are remembered. You know, bands like the Beatles, U2, the Rolling Stones etc. Creed wasn't legendary and I don't think I ever claimed that they were. They were, however, a darn good band that made some good music together. They'll be remembered by Creed fans for a long, long time, but forgotten about by most of the general music public.

[uncertaindrumer]

^So where were you when we were having this argument a week or two ago?!? lol

[titan9]

Did we have that argument a week ago? Point me to the thread, because my brain must not be working properly. :laugh:

[uncertaindrumer]

Working W/ Goneblind thread... people kept saying how Creed would be remembered for years to come by everyone and I was attempting to show them the error of their ways... heh

[titan9]

But did I say that they'd be remembered for years to come by everyone? I post so much that I forget about it within a few days. :laugh:

[SummerGirl]

So, did the numbers come in? Guess I'm being lazy, but I really don't know where to look other than a google search. Thanks!

[evyllsummer]

Exactly. This has got to be the best Creed/Alter Bridge/Stapp board on the internet. It is superbly moderated and the vast majority of the people on here are polite and friendly. I've been to other Creed/AB/Stapp boards, and have never felt comfortable at those boards. .

well, I can think of ONE AB board that's pretty darn cool...*looks over shoulder for Steve*

but, yeah, I like this board...very civil...

[titan9]

Yeah, definitely. I mean, there's always going to be a member or two who is the exception to the rule, but the admin/mods here do a good job of getting rid of the distructive members.

You're referring to Abb.net's board, right? I think I registered there, but I've never really taken the time to read it and decide if I'd feel comfortable there. I am registered at PBF, but I don't post, I just read. So far, I haven't felt comfortable enough there to post.

[evyllsummer]

Yeah, definitely. I mean, there's always going to be a member or two who is the exception to the rule, but the admin/mods here do a good job of getting rid of the distructive members.

You're referring to Abb.net's board, right? I think I registered there, but I've never really taken the time to read it and decide if I'd feel comfortable there. I am registered at PBF, but I don't post, I just read. So far, I haven't felt comfortable enough there to post.

eh, well, I'm sure all the good information makes it over here...Steve's really cool about that...but, yeah, we go to pains to make it civil over there, which is why this place is pretty darn cool, too...

[Unforgiven Fan]

it is official....19 on the chart....


alterbridge was #1 if I remember correctly...

[titan9]

Nope, they were #5 when they debuted. They sold roughly 1,000 more copies of their debut than Stapp did. Not too much of a difference, so I'd say they're on an equal level(as far as success is concerned) right now.

[Trimontana]

I cant say they are on the same level right now. Anyway debuted at #5 and debuted at #19 isnt the same...huge difference even the number, 1000 copies more, is not that big. No comparison saying the are at the same level when AB album is more than a year old and Stapp's album is just released...AB have done a worldwide tour for all this time, and just let's see if Stapp will do it (i dont care what his intentions are....i wanna actions)

[titan9]

I'm talking in terms of sales they're equal(that's what I meant). And I don't pay attention to the ranking, because the actual sales matters more. Stapp faced some tough competition this week(S.O.A.D., Madonna etc.) yet still managed to sell 94,000 copies. That's not bad, all things considered.

[The Lithium]

I cant say they are on the same level right now. Anyway debuted at #5 and debuted at #19 isnt the same...huge difference
Yeah! There's 12 albums in between the #19th and the #5th!

[uncertaindrumer]

I'm talking in terms of sales they're equal(that's what I meant). And I don't pay attention to the ranking, because the actual sales matters more. Stapp faced some tough competition this week(S.O.A.D., Madonna etc.) yet still managed to sell 94,000 copies. That's not bad, all things considered.

Sales is not as good of an indicator as chart #. Think about it. Any amount of sales MIGHT be good or bad, but depending on which time you release it, it could be a good time or a bad time. Stapp released his album at a much more seller friendly time (right before the Holidays) and yet managed to still only sell the same amount as AB who released their album at the END of the summer which is not exactly a wonderful time at all. So I would say the #19 versus #5 is much better. Of course there is also something to be said for more albums debuting at the same time and whatnot but let's face it, we track things by their ranking according to others in their time--we do it with everything, such as sports, sales, etc. etc. Stapp came out in 19th, AB in 5th.

But seriously, neither of those is anything to be impressed with... at all. I was dissapointed by AB's showing (but not surprised, because of... GRRRR, Open Your Eyes), and totally not surprised by Stapp's dissapointing but predictable pitiful opening. I tried to tell you guys his fanbase had mostly deserted him. Whether he can win it back is another thing, but clearly they left.

Anyway I don't know why I just totally rambled for five minutes... oh well. :D

[Robin101]

AB vs SS.......ZZZZZZZ!!! :D

Take Care

[crest tattoo]

I looked up top albums on VH1 two days ago, and SS was at #9 now. What does that mean?

[Bridge of Clay]

91,000 is still quite a fan base

[titan9]

91,000 is still quite a fan base

Agreed. And you gotta figure that out of those millions who bought MOP, HC and Weathered, most weren't exactly loyal fans. A lot of them were casual fans, not die hards. A lot of them probably also tired of Creed after hearing them on the radio so much, after hearing of Stapp's issues and some probably stopped being fans because it became cool to hate the band.

94,000 is a far cry from 800,000(roughly what Weathered did in it's first week) but all things considered, that's a good number. Neither AB nor Stapp should be ashamed of selling just under 100,000 records in their first week.

[Robin101]

Anyone care to estimate what they think TGD will sell in total between now and this time next year, judging by the opening weeks figures and previous albums which have sold roughly the same.

[uncertaindrumer]

Anyone care to estimate what they think TGD will sell in total between now and this time next year, judging by the opening weeks figures and previous albums which have sold roughly the same.

400,000?

And come on guys (especially Titan)... If you tell me this is what you were predicting all I have to do is go find your prediction and paste it. This is less than you thought and you know it.

After selling 30 million albums in however many years (as everyone LOVES beating me over the head with) selling 90,000 means you lost a LOT of fans. AB lost them through a combination of OYE and "Who are they?". Stapp lost them because... He's Stapp.

[titan9]

Anyone care to estimate what they think TGD will sell in total between now and this time next year, judging by the opening weeks figures and previous albums which have sold roughly the same.

I'd say it'll go Gold, particularly if the next single(perhaps Surround Me) gets good airplay. TGD hasn't taken off as a single, but I think SM has that ability to be a big hit.

And come on guys (especially Titan)... If you tell me this is what you were predicting all I have to do is go find your prediction and paste it. This is less than you thought and you know it.

Yes, I predicted sales of 200,000-400,000 in the first week. Looking back, I did so because I honestly assumed a few things: (1) That a good deal of Creed/Stapp fans remained (2) That TGD would get good airplay on the radio and (3) That the album would receive more publicity(from the media) than what it did. Obviously, I was wrong on all three accounts, which meant that my projection was off by at least 100,000.

Besides that, I assumed that radio stations would be open to playing TGD, which they obviously aren't because of the past. An example of this: yesterday, I did an online request for both TGD and AB's FTR, under different names at roughly the same time(I actually requested TGD first!). Guess which one got played? You guessed it, FTR. I'm going to do another experiment today, this time requesting My Own Prison and TGD. We'll see which one gets played. My bet is on MOP.

Still, considering how hated Creed became, considering the dumb stuff Stapp has done, 94,000 isn't too bad. It's not a huge number, but it's not a pitiful number either. Pitiful, to me, is under 50,000.

[Robin101]

I'd say it'll go Gold, particularly if the next single(perhaps Surround Me) gets good airplay. TGD hasn't taken off as a single, but I think SM has that ability to be a big hit.

If Stapp releases SM as his next single I don't think his album sales will rise dramatically. Don't get me wrong, I love the song. It's just too similar to TGD.

I would take a chance and go with Fight Song or Justify.

Take Care

[Bridge of Clay]

actually it'll go Planitum. Steve Lermer (or whatever, Wind-Up's CEO) said they'll ship 1,500,000 copies. That's platinum.

[evyllsummer]

actually it'll go Planitum. Steve Lermer (or whatever, Wind-Up's CEO) said they'll ship 1,500,000 copies. That's platinum.

well, after Stapp's HUGE drop from #19 to currently #28 (and may be lower as the day goes on), he may rethink that...

[titan9]

I'm thinkin' maybe it isn't a good idea to ship that many quite yet. Obviously, the first single is receiving disappointing airplay. Maybe they should wait to ship a million until after one of the singles catches on?

Where'd you hear that he's dropping to number 28? I just checked hitsdailydouble.com and it says he's currently projected to be at 25. Not a huge drop, but the album still isn't doing as well as a lot of people(including myself) expected. I think hitsdaily has it selling around 30-40K in the second week.

EDIT: I stand corrected. It seems hitsdaily has roughly 50% of the sales in, and TGD has thus far sold roughly 27,000. It appears that the real number will be roughly(I guess that's my favorite word today! :D) double that(54,000). We'll see for sure on Thursday.

[crest tattoo]

Now, on VH1, he went from #19 to #12???? So go figure.

[Bridge of Clay]

well, after Stapp's HUGE drop from #19 to currently #28 (and may be lower as the day goes on), he may rethink that...
agreed, but the way I understood, I thought he had already shipped them all.

[evyllsummer]

agreed, but the way I understood, I thought he had already shipped them all.

if they had already been shipped, they would have awarded Stapp the platinum records right then and there...they are awarded the records when they ship, then, should they actually SELL that many, it is then Certified Platinum (or Gold)...

[Bridge of Clay]

I see. Cool!

oh well... let's see what happens. But I think all this stuff is good to AB anyway.

[Ana4Stapp]

400,000?

After selling 30 million albums in however many years (as everyone LOVES beating me over the head with) selling 90,000 means you lost a LOT of fans. AB lost them through a combination of OYE and "Who are they?". Stapp lost them because... He's Stapp.
:rolleyes:


Billboard chart singles

2005 The Great Divide Mainstream Rock Tracks - 20

2005 The Great Divide Pop 100 - 84

Billboard 200 albums chart - 19

[evyllsummer]

I see. Cool!

oh well... let's see what happens. But I think all this stuff is good to AB anyway.

yeah, it's all good...I have to admit, though, I DO kinda hope that Stapp pulls it together...if for no other reason, for his fans...and, too, despite all of the lies and behavior, every time I hear an interview with him, I want to like the guy...

[sina2b]

and considering the amount of promotion stapp received and how much WU has invested on him, Im sure AB has been more profitable in their first week therefor more successfull atleast till now.